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	<title>Comments on: Op-ed at Pajamas Media</title>
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	<description>Some Chicago Boyz know each other from student days at the University of Chicago. Others are Chicago boys in spirit. The blog name is also intended as a good-humored gesture of admiration for distinguished Chicago boys including those pictured above.</description>
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		<title>By: Jonathan</title>
		<link>http://chicagoboyz.net/archives/6593.html/comment-page-1#comment-289995</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Jan 2009 01:28:16 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Good if true.

Remember the many clever political and bureaucratic maneuvers that we used to attribute to George Bush and that came to nothing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good if true.</p>
<p>Remember the many clever political and bureaucratic maneuvers that we used to attribute to George Bush and that came to nothing.</p>
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		<title>By: Mrs. Davis</title>
		<link>http://chicagoboyz.net/archives/6593.html/comment-page-1#comment-289989</link>
		<dc:creator>Mrs. Davis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Jan 2009 23:09:50 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I&#039;d say the CIA has been in existential crisis since 1961 and has been a dead man walking since the Church Committee finished with it. Those Reagan years seem to be mostly good PR as resorting to the unfortunate use of the comic Ollie North to support the Central America&#039;s democratic forces indicates. 

The other thing to keep in mind is that Rumsfeld began a process of moving ops from CIA to DIA years ago. I cannot believe this was irrelevant or coincidental in the choice of Gates to succeed him. I must confess that I was quite disappointed in the selection of Gates, but that his performance has been far from disappointing. I suspect he has also been very active in the aspects of the GWOT that we cannot see and that this success was part of The One&#039;s decision to retain him in place. 

Given that Gates is a former DCI and career employee of CIA and given that the primary problems at the CIA are its involvement in domestic political intrigues, it makes a lot of sense to put a politician in place to clean it up. I suspect that the CIA will not go away, but that the Directorate of Operations will be making substantial contributions to deficit reduction and will wither on the vine if not disappear. DIA will become much more involved in covert ops, either directly or through subcontractors.

I believe many Washington insiders recognize what is going down and are upset exactly because the CIA will lose a lot of its ability to play games in domestic politics. Sources will be drying up. Playing political footsie will not be the same career builder at DIA that it was at CIA. This is a major victory for OpSec.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d say the CIA has been in existential crisis since 1961 and has been a dead man walking since the Church Committee finished with it. Those Reagan years seem to be mostly good PR as resorting to the unfortunate use of the comic Ollie North to support the Central America&#8217;s democratic forces indicates. </p>
<p>The other thing to keep in mind is that Rumsfeld began a process of moving ops from CIA to DIA years ago. I cannot believe this was irrelevant or coincidental in the choice of Gates to succeed him. I must confess that I was quite disappointed in the selection of Gates, but that his performance has been far from disappointing. I suspect he has also been very active in the aspects of the GWOT that we cannot see and that this success was part of The One&#8217;s decision to retain him in place. </p>
<p>Given that Gates is a former DCI and career employee of CIA and given that the primary problems at the CIA are its involvement in domestic political intrigues, it makes a lot of sense to put a politician in place to clean it up. I suspect that the CIA will not go away, but that the Directorate of Operations will be making substantial contributions to deficit reduction and will wither on the vine if not disappear. DIA will become much more involved in covert ops, either directly or through subcontractors.</p>
<p>I believe many Washington insiders recognize what is going down and are upset exactly because the CIA will lose a lot of its ability to play games in domestic politics. Sources will be drying up. Playing political footsie will not be the same career builder at DIA that it was at CIA. This is a major victory for OpSec.</p>
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		<title>By: sol vason</title>
		<link>http://chicagoboyz.net/archives/6593.html/comment-page-1#comment-289951</link>
		<dc:creator>sol vason</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Jan 2009 17:33:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://chicagoboyz.net/?p=6593#comment-289951</guid>
		<description>The CIA was established to gather together the information/intelligence output of all the Federal agencies dealing with other countries for the President.  The Director of National Intelligence now has this role.  I think Bush already relies on other, more obscure agencies for intelligence rather than use CIA product, and that Bush uses the CIA as a lightning rod.  To this end he has given the swashbuckling, movie star jobs to the CIA.  Panetta is the good choice to head this type of agency - Matt Damon would be better -- provided he has his current script writer and director.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The CIA was established to gather together the information/intelligence output of all the Federal agencies dealing with other countries for the President.  The Director of National Intelligence now has this role.  I think Bush already relies on other, more obscure agencies for intelligence rather than use CIA product, and that Bush uses the CIA as a lightning rod.  To this end he has given the swashbuckling, movie star jobs to the CIA.  Panetta is the good choice to head this type of agency &#8211; Matt Damon would be better &#8212; provided he has his current script writer and director.</p>
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		<title>By: Ginny</title>
		<link>http://chicagoboyz.net/archives/6593.html/comment-page-1#comment-289918</link>
		<dc:creator>Ginny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Jan 2009 07:38:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://chicagoboyz.net/?p=6593#comment-289918</guid>
		<description>Thanks Zenpundit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Zenpundit.</p>
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		<title>By: Shannon Love</title>
		<link>http://chicagoboyz.net/archives/6593.html/comment-page-1#comment-289880</link>
		<dc:creator>Shannon Love</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Jan 2009 01:28:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://chicagoboyz.net/?p=6593#comment-289880</guid>
		<description>Sol Vason,

Eliminating the CIA won&#039;t help our image because the same people who believe the CIA is evil will simply project their fantasies onto its successor/s. The most vehement objections to the CIA come from those who adopt Stalin&#039;s view of the America&#039;s role in the world. The CIA becomes the evil tool of an evil capitalist, imperialist country. People that hold that view of America won&#039;t be mollified by an intelligence reorganization.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sol Vason,</p>
<p>Eliminating the CIA won&#8217;t help our image because the same people who believe the CIA is evil will simply project their fantasies onto its successor/s. The most vehement objections to the CIA come from those who adopt Stalin&#8217;s view of the America&#8217;s role in the world. The CIA becomes the evil tool of an evil capitalist, imperialist country. People that hold that view of America won&#8217;t be mollified by an intelligence reorganization.</p>
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		<title>By: sol vason</title>
		<link>http://chicagoboyz.net/archives/6593.html/comment-page-1#comment-289865</link>
		<dc:creator>sol vason</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2009 22:35:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://chicagoboyz.net/?p=6593#comment-289865</guid>
		<description>Why try to save the CIA?  It has a bad reputation and its intelligence is unreliable.  Its existence gives the US a bad name.  What better way is there to improve the image of the US than to eliminate the CIA.  Intelligence gathering will go on.  Indeed, the best employees of the CIA will find work with any of the 50 different intelligence agencies that already exist in the Federal government or with any of the 10 privately owned agencies. 

This will not stop movies from being made about the CIA.  They still make movies about the NAZIs.  Indeed hatred of the CIA is so extreme that Valerie Plame claimed that exposing her as a CIA employee endangered her life.  

It is customary to eliminate intelligence agencies when they become unpopular.  All governments do this.  The GPU, NKVD, and KGB  no longer exist. Neither do the Gestapo or the Stasi.  But their functions are still performed for the very people who eliminated their predecessors.  

PR requires eliminating the CIA, divorcing ourselves from its evil,  and handing out its functions to agencies nobody ever heard of.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why try to save the CIA?  It has a bad reputation and its intelligence is unreliable.  Its existence gives the US a bad name.  What better way is there to improve the image of the US than to eliminate the CIA.  Intelligence gathering will go on.  Indeed, the best employees of the CIA will find work with any of the 50 different intelligence agencies that already exist in the Federal government or with any of the 10 privately owned agencies. </p>
<p>This will not stop movies from being made about the CIA.  They still make movies about the NAZIs.  Indeed hatred of the CIA is so extreme that Valerie Plame claimed that exposing her as a CIA employee endangered her life.  </p>
<p>It is customary to eliminate intelligence agencies when they become unpopular.  All governments do this.  The GPU, NKVD, and KGB  no longer exist. Neither do the Gestapo or the Stasi.  But their functions are still performed for the very people who eliminated their predecessors.  </p>
<p>PR requires eliminating the CIA, divorcing ourselves from its evil,  and handing out its functions to agencies nobody ever heard of.</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan</title>
		<link>http://chicagoboyz.net/archives/6593.html/comment-page-1#comment-289861</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2009 22:05:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://chicagoboyz.net/?p=6593#comment-289861</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s not what I wrote. The people Obama is appointing for these posts are not necessarily the worst people for their respective positions. However, Obama appears to be selecting them based mainly on domestic political considerations. IMO this appointment pattern, which resembles that of Bill Clinton, does not predict best results.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s not what I wrote. The people Obama is appointing for these posts are not necessarily the worst people for their respective positions. However, Obama appears to be selecting them based mainly on domestic political considerations. IMO this appointment pattern, which resembles that of Bill Clinton, does not predict best results.</p>
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		<title>By: Lexington Green`</title>
		<link>http://chicagoboyz.net/archives/6593.html/comment-page-1#comment-289834</link>
		<dc:creator>Lexington Green`</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2009 15:36:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://chicagoboyz.net/?p=6593#comment-289834</guid>
		<description>Right, we know that if he appoints terrible people, its because he&#039;s awful.  And if he appoints good people, that just means he&#039;s clever and deceptive in addition to being awful.  There can be no basis for hoping for anything less that utter awfulness.  That is a given.  We know categorically that he is awful and all facts necessarily conform to that preexisting knowledge.  Any seeming ray of light is a mirage to dupe the naive.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Right, we know that if he appoints terrible people, its because he&#8217;s awful.  And if he appoints good people, that just means he&#8217;s clever and deceptive in addition to being awful.  There can be no basis for hoping for anything less that utter awfulness.  That is a given.  We know categorically that he is awful and all facts necessarily conform to that preexisting knowledge.  Any seeming ray of light is a mirage to dupe the naive.</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan</title>
		<link>http://chicagoboyz.net/archives/6593.html/comment-page-1#comment-289783</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2009 05:32:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://chicagoboyz.net/?p=6593#comment-289783</guid>
		<description>This is all wishful thinking, as is the notion that Obama&#039;s retention of Gates was a good sign. What Obama&#039;s personnel choices signify is that he cares little about foreign, military and intelligence issues except to the extent that they might damage him politically. So he appoints hacks and followers of conventional wisdom. This is the point that Peters seems to be making.

Perhaps Obama will appoint James Baker to represent him in the coming negotiations with Hamas.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is all wishful thinking, as is the notion that Obama&#8217;s retention of Gates was a good sign. What Obama&#8217;s personnel choices signify is that he cares little about foreign, military and intelligence issues except to the extent that they might damage him politically. So he appoints hacks and followers of conventional wisdom. This is the point that Peters seems to be making.</p>
<p>Perhaps Obama will appoint James Baker to represent him in the coming negotiations with Hamas.</p>
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		<title>By: Robert Schwartz</title>
		<link>http://chicagoboyz.net/archives/6593.html/comment-page-1#comment-289780</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Schwartz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2009 05:15:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://chicagoboyz.net/?p=6593#comment-289780</guid>
		<description>Sol: The Brown Acid is bad. Go to the medical tent right away. 

I wish I could care who ran the CIA, but I can&#039;t, because I think the agency is in terminal bureaucratic decline. One of George bush&#039;s worst mistakes was not firing the top 10 people at the CIA and the FBI on the morning of 9/12/2001. The Director of the CIA, has for better or worse, lost his pride of place in the Intelligence hierarchy. Now that the CIA is no longer useful to the Donkey Party as a stick with which to beat the President, perhaps they can get around to replacing it something that works, if only a little bit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sol: The Brown Acid is bad. Go to the medical tent right away. </p>
<p>I wish I could care who ran the CIA, but I can&#8217;t, because I think the agency is in terminal bureaucratic decline. One of George bush&#8217;s worst mistakes was not firing the top 10 people at the CIA and the FBI on the morning of 9/12/2001. The Director of the CIA, has for better or worse, lost his pride of place in the Intelligence hierarchy. Now that the CIA is no longer useful to the Donkey Party as a stick with which to beat the President, perhaps they can get around to replacing it something that works, if only a little bit.</p>
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		<title>By: sol vason</title>
		<link>http://chicagoboyz.net/archives/6593.html/comment-page-1#comment-289761</link>
		<dc:creator>sol vason</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jan 2009 23:26:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://chicagoboyz.net/?p=6593#comment-289761</guid>
		<description>The CIA should be terminated with extreme prejudice.  No one can fix the agency.  As everybody knows:
1.  It tortures prisoners
2.  It maintains secret prisons where innocent people, including American citizens, are routinely tortured and held without due process
3.  It has destroyed America&#039;s reputation
4.  As the Valerie Plame affair and the leaked NIEs demonstrate, the CIA answers to no one.  It is above the law and a danger to our democracy
5.  It provides unreliable intelligence and disinformation to the President and the Congress
6.  It spies on American citizens
7.  It has been penetrated by most foreign goverments and several terrorist organizations and three world religions and four political ideologies. It is no longer loyal to the US.  

By destroying the CIA, the US will take the first step to rebuild its reputation in the World.  By destroying the CIA headquarters the US will send a dramatic signal to the world that it no longer embraces the evil that the CIA represents.  Naturally, those employees that are loyal to the US can find employment in the US, while the rest will continue on the payroll of their true employers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The CIA should be terminated with extreme prejudice.  No one can fix the agency.  As everybody knows:<br />
1.  It tortures prisoners<br />
2.  It maintains secret prisons where innocent people, including American citizens, are routinely tortured and held without due process<br />
3.  It has destroyed America&#8217;s reputation<br />
4.  As the Valerie Plame affair and the leaked NIEs demonstrate, the CIA answers to no one.  It is above the law and a danger to our democracy<br />
5.  It provides unreliable intelligence and disinformation to the President and the Congress<br />
6.  It spies on American citizens<br />
7.  It has been penetrated by most foreign goverments and several terrorist organizations and three world religions and four political ideologies. It is no longer loyal to the US.  </p>
<p>By destroying the CIA, the US will take the first step to rebuild its reputation in the World.  By destroying the CIA headquarters the US will send a dramatic signal to the world that it no longer embraces the evil that the CIA represents.  Naturally, those employees that are loyal to the US can find employment in the US, while the rest will continue on the payroll of their true employers.</p>
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		<title>By: Lexington Green`</title>
		<link>http://chicagoboyz.net/archives/6593.html/comment-page-1#comment-289739</link>
		<dc:creator>Lexington Green`</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jan 2009 19:56:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://chicagoboyz.net/?p=6593#comment-289739</guid>
		<description>Peters&#039; op-ed stuff is not too good.  

He is better with longer pieces where he has time to cool off before he hits &quot;send&quot; to his editor.  His articles in Parameters are almost all classics.  

Mark&#039;s analysis is much more thoughtful and realistic than Peters&#039;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Peters&#8217; op-ed stuff is not too good.  </p>
<p>He is better with longer pieces where he has time to cool off before he hits &#8220;send&#8221; to his editor.  His articles in Parameters are almost all classics.  </p>
<p>Mark&#8217;s analysis is much more thoughtful and realistic than Peters&#8217;.</p>
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		<title>By: zenpundit</title>
		<link>http://chicagoboyz.net/archives/6593.html/comment-page-1#comment-289726</link>
		<dc:creator>zenpundit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jan 2009 18:06:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://chicagoboyz.net/?p=6593#comment-289726</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;&quot;If you handed Leon Panetta a blank map of Asia, I&#039;d bet my life he couldn&#039;t plot Baghdad, Kabul or Beijing within 500 miles of their actual locations&quot;&lt;/b&gt; 

Leon Panetta was an Army intelligence officer during the Vietnam War. I&#039;m sure he can read a map as well as Peters can; they had the same training after all. ;)

Ralph Peters is actually a smart guy and not a buffoon but he plays one from time to time at the Post.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>&#8220;If you handed Leon Panetta a blank map of Asia, I&#8217;d bet my life he couldn&#8217;t plot Baghdad, Kabul or Beijing within 500 miles of their actual locations&#8221;</b> </p>
<p>Leon Panetta was an Army intelligence officer during the Vietnam War. I&#8217;m sure he can read a map as well as Peters can; they had the same training after all. ;)</p>
<p>Ralph Peters is actually a smart guy and not a buffoon but he plays one from time to time at the Post.</p>
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		<title>By: david foster</title>
		<link>http://chicagoboyz.net/archives/6593.html/comment-page-1#comment-289718</link>
		<dc:creator>david foster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jan 2009 16:48:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://chicagoboyz.net/?p=6593#comment-289718</guid>
		<description>A different view from &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.nypost.com/seven/01072009/postopinion/opedcolumnists/an_awful_pick_148973.htm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Ralph Peters&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A different view from <a href="http://www.nypost.com/seven/01072009/postopinion/opedcolumnists/an_awful_pick_148973.htm" rel="nofollow">Ralph Peters</a>.</p>
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