Today there was a mass shooting event today in El Paso Texas, in a Walmart.
There is some evidence that the mass shooting took place in a “Gun Free Zone.” This is still being sorted out. I live in Arizona and have a CCW permit, but I usually do not carry a gun. I do have one in my car. I do see quite a few shops that do not allow guns inside.
There is some evidence that that the shooter may be Hispanic, but the story resembles the New Zealand Shooter who attacked a mosque. In that case also there was a “manifesto” giving his motives.
With both of these incidents with mass shootings, there is some resemblance to the incident in Norway where a “white supremacist” attacked children at a Socialist summer camp on an island.
The Norwegian Police arrested Anders Behring Breivik, a 32-year-old Norwegian right-wing extremist,[25] on Utøya island[26] and charged him with both attacks.[27] His trial took place between 16 April and 22 June 2012 in Oslo District Court, where Breivik admitted carrying out the attacks, but denied criminal guilt and claimed the defense of necessity (jus necessitatis).[28] On 24 August, Breivik was convicted as charged and sentenced to 21 years of preventive detention in prison, the maximum sentence allowed in Norway. The sentence can be extended indefinitely as long as the prisoner is deemed a threat to society.
What is going on here?
Breivik is linked to a 1,518-page compendium entitled 2083: A European Declaration of Independence bearing the name “Andrew Berwick”.[31][32][151] The file was e-mailed to 1,003 addresses about 90 minutes before the bomb blast in Oslo.[152][153] Analysts described him as having Islamophobic views and a hatred of Islam,[154][155] and as someone who considered himself as a knight dedicated to stemming the tide of Muslim immigration into Europe.
What about New Zealand?
the posts suggest that every aspect of the shootings was designed to gain maximum attention online, in part by baiting the media. The shooter live-streamed the attack itself on Facebook, and the video was quickly shared across YouTube, Twitter, and Instagram. Before committing the act, he shouted, “Remember, lads, subscribe to PewDiePie,” a reference to Felix Kjellberg, who runs YouTube’s most subscribed-to channel. The phrase itself is a meme started by PewDiePie’s fans, and its goal is to be reprinted.\
In both cases, the shooter surrendered and was not killed. Why? They seemed to want a public forum for their causes. The El Paso shooter also surrendered. We will see what the motive was.
I follow the 24/7 rule on carrying. For me, unless there’s a metal detector involved, i.e. entering a courthouse (a rare occurence), I am never w/o a firearm. I could care less about their “no weapons” signs. I value my life more then their rules. Also, I always try to make an unobtrusive pause for a few seconds when entering a building/waiting area & do a right-to-left scan of my surroundings. Screw their no weapons rules.
Mike, I think you misread the info on the shooter.
Like I said last night, I don’t know what to make of the fact that after a few days of news about antifa coming to El Paso in a few weeks, this happens. It seems very odd.
A conspiracy theorist would note that now antifa is going to have sympathy from many quarters that they wouldn’t have otherwise had. I hate conspiracy theories, but I hope the authorities are really transparent, and for instance release full security camera video, which they never did in Las Vega for some inexplicable reason.
I also wonder if antifa’s awful street riots don’t serve as somewhat of a release valve of sorts. Maybe that’s enough real world, in person “direct action” to prevent people from going completely off the deep end the way that these crazies who live on internet chat boards do.
Those who think they can use this to push gun control need to look at what happened after Killeen. TX had super strict gun laws, and Ann Richards’ refusal to reconsider them led to her defeat by W and the final death of the old Democrat party in TX.
It looks ever more clear that gun rights and the direct connection to personal liberty, and the otherization of political opponents in this area, are going to lead to civil war. The rhetoric is like the 1850s in so many ways.
I don’t know about the world wide shootings, but the ones in the US are distinctly connected in that they want to spread the idea that there is a pervasive and strong group of organized “White Supremacists” and racists on the right. They specifically have been trying to target Republicans, Tea Party and of course Donald Trump.
Now, I am not saying there are NO racists or extreme right wing people. They are not the norm, nor are they pervasive.
However….since repeating and repeating the mantra hasn’t worked and since most of the population has yawned at this tired old tactic. The dedicated progressive/socialists and antifa types have decide to up their game with false manifestos and “shootings was designed to gain maximum attention online, in part by baiting the media.” The media being breathlessly complicit in this.
The point is to try to sway the voters, sway public opinion and make their dreams of Socialism a factual nightmare in the United States. Make the people afraid of Republicans, red hats, and get them to vote for or accept the insanity of the left as a safer harbor. Get them to doubt their own minds. George Orwell was very prophetic.
People like this current shooter have been sucked in and brainwashed by the movement, the internet and by their own inadequate personalities. Mentally ill people are easiest to recruit.
They won’t rest until we have a real revolution. However, I don’t think that the revolution will turn out quite as they dream it will. The Normals, the quiet people, will get quite fed up with this and remember..we are armed.
This shooting may be a copy cat but is not like the others.
1 AM in a bar and the shooter was killed. Still very early.
There are some strange things going on with this shooting.
The CTH thread is full of stuff I don’t buy but this is interesting.
Like this.
Some people captured this guy’s facebook profile and it is being changed, after the shooting. I’m not buying the conspiracy theories but something is going on.
The El Paso killer did so out of anti-immigration and racist motives (the two motives are somewhat distinct in the manifesto). His manifesto is available on the Drudge Report. It is relatively well written, suggesting that this loser is not schizophrenic, but rather very misguided and evil.
How this POS thought that shooting innocent people would help his cause is beyond me.
That he reportedly (it’s still early) was able to keep shooting for 20 minutes suggests not enough shoppers were armed.
False-flag cannot be ruled out. Yet.
The other laughable thing is that people are equating “white supremacy” with “right-wing conservative”. Really? Interesting, that–The whole white supremacy/superiority thing grows out of what two movements, again? Oh; right–The KKK, and the Nazis. Which end of the ideological spectrum were those two on, in reality? Right; the Left.
But, where does the media put the blame? On their ideological opponents, who’ve hardly been on the forefront of the “White Supremacist” movement, leaving that to the Democrats and their ilk. Wilson was a white supremacist who re-segregated the Federal Government, and cheer-led the re-establishment of the KKK as a significant force across America. The man was an unreconstructed Confederate, and an utter disaster as a President–Yet, who is lionized by whom? Same with all the rest–FDR’s racism is well-documented, and he was key to kow-towing to the various anti-Semite groups who wanted to refuse entry of Jewish refugees from the Germans.
No, you go back and examine the reality, white supremacism is an ideology of the left, almost entirely. You look at the supposed bastions of conservatism, and what you’ll find is an almost suicidal love of the “other”–After all, who’s been behind bringing in all the Somalis to Minnesota? Mostly, the oh-so-Christian churches that we associate with “conservatism” when everyone starts demonizing the Right. Said churches actually tend towards social leftism on the liberal scale, but… It’s all part of the Great Confusion that has the Nazis as Right Wing, and the Bad Guys. Whole thing is ‘effing nuts, to be honest. I think most of the population has to be historically ignorant on a scale that defies comprehension for them to believe any of this crap, but there you are: Idiocy abounds, everywhere.
I have read that the El Paso killer’s manifesto is big on environmentalism and socialism (universal income and universal health care).
To be fair, we do have some white nationalists/supremacists on the right. If you don’t believe me, go read the comments on takimag.com. Takimag is a paleocon site, and while few articles are white nationalist, lots of comments are, and I doubt they are false flag – a real phenomenon but too easy an excuse.
There is another possibility in these events,
Perhaps there is a group of murderous nihilists.
A genuine political terrorist doesn’t want to be taken alive. The goon in Washington State last month wasn’t. Truly crazy mass shooters don’t want to be taken alive either. They often turn their guns on themselves or force the cops to kill them.?
This also struck me. They surrender. The Broward County shooter also hid his gun and tried to pass as a student. What is going on?
Van Spronsen’s manifesto, as disjointed as it was, provided a clear motive.
The ChristChurch demon & his copycats are purposefully writing manifestos that are a smorgasbord of conflicting political rhetoric, almost none of which they believe.
These shitposters **know** how the mainstream media reacts to one of these mass shooting events, how both sides immediately start poring over the manifesto, scouring the social media, each trying to say to the other “AHA! HE BLONGS TO YOU GUYS!”
Possible ? I don’t know.
I doubt they are false flag – a real phenomenon but too easy an excuse.
I also read Taki and Unz. A mixture of anti-Semitism and some level of white nationalism.
Also, think about how society is treating white boys these days, Especially white boys who are not educated and therefore of limited economic means.
You keep demonizing people for things that they have no control over, you shouldn’t be surprised if they start acting like demons.
There are signs that the Dayton shooter was severely troubled; apparently he had a history of abusive behavior towards women. Note that nothing effective was done to treat that, or keep weapons out of his hands, and that one of the first two people he killed was his own sister. Who apparently got into a car with him, and maybe drove him down to that bar…
Which is just ‘effing bizarre.
I think the issue for society at large is that we are reaping what has been sown for so many years, in regards to a huge swathe of social issues. The activists have been agitating for things that really do not work, and here we are, in the land-where-things-ain’t-quite-right.
More on the manipulation of social media after the El Paso shooting.
The Dayton shooter was with his sister (who he killed) and her boyfriend who drove him to the bar. With a rifle ???
Nothing about the internet is to be trusted at this point. I’m still amazed that Christine Blasely Ford was able to completely erase her internet presence before coming forward. Who can do that? And why was no one she ever interacted with able to have preserved anything?
After Las Vegas especially I don’t see how local or federal agencies can be trusted to honestly share info on these attacks. This one is especially odd with multiple people saying clearly and calmly that they saw multiple shooters. That’s different from saying they thought there were shooting sounds coming from multiple directions, this seems much harder to explain away as just a fog of war type of thing. It should be easy to just release the security cams, that should resolve everything, but I feel quite confident that that will never happen.
Yeah, Mike… The stories are not at all clear. Was it a hostage situation? Was it a surprise to her and her boyfriend…?
Both these incidents are full of “WTF?”; the El Paso shooter drives nine hours and six hundred miles to shoot Mexicans he could have walked out his door to find (if that was the motivation…), and then when he gets to the Walmart he shoots up, the actual percentage of Mexicans he shot was around 14%, the rest being “fellow Americans”. Whole series of things here simply do not make sense. El Paso shooter’s dad looks like a real nut job, family situation is bizarre, and I’d like to know how it is that a “sound therapist” can afford a freakin’ McMansion in a nice suburb of Dallas…
More I see of this, the more I have to wonder if we’re not all being gaslighted. Why is it that the Antifa clowns have targeted the one liberal border town, and not, say… Brownsville? El Paso is seriously deep blue, so why chose to go cause trouble in Beto O’rourke’s old district?
Someone shows me one hint this whole thing is a set-up, false-flag operation, and I hate to say it, but I’m gonna have to take that nuttiness seriously.
Kirk, I’m with you. I don’t know what is happening.
It may be a network of violent nihilists but that is to be seen. I still have no idea what happened in Las Vegas., There was a woman lawyer who was handing a bunch of lawsuits and who looked like she might get some answers. I have seen nothing about her in the last year, Maybe they were all paid off.
If the authorities were actively trying to make everyone think they were lying about all of these incidents, they could not possibly be doing a better job. Especially with Las Vegas…
I would be willing to accept that perhaps with Las Vegas it’s more a case of the casino industry and local government trying to keep a lid on things and maintain status quo, but… The optics are terrible; the hotel he fired from is owned by a consortium that includes Saudi investors, it caters to Arab gamblers, and there are a whole lot of unanswered questions about what actually happened the night of the shooting. Plus, the evidence where the shooter tried firing at the fuel depot, and all the rest of the attendant confusion about what happened, where it happened, and on and on and on. The way the security guard was spirited away, then suddenly reappears after he’s had time to get the official story down…?
Seriously, if I were to plan out how to make the whole thing look shady and discredit the authorities, there’s not much I’d have to change. The more strings you pull, the less credibility the whole thing has.
I’m also a little suspicious about the way all these “spree killers” have started appearing, of late: The one thing that you generally find with people who mass murder is that they don’t start right off with killing. There is generally a pattern of escalation, of habituation–Overcoming a lifetime of programming not to kill is not easy, for most people. Look at this recent kid in Walmart; he’s coming in that doorway like it’s something he does everyday, about like I’d expect one of my troops to do in a shoot house. He’s not looking like someone who is doing this for the first time, which leads to my next question: Where the hell did he get training and experience? This isn’t something that you pick up via video games, although they can help. The video I’ve seen released of this guy coming in that door is really thought-provoking, because he’s not looking like a first-timer. Also, the trip from his car to the door, where he’s shooting people on the way? Look at the bodies; he caught them completely unaware, and you’d think that after the first few shots, someone would have reacted. Not to mention, him–There’s no trace of “buck fever”, which just about everyone experiences the first time they shoot at something with intent to kill.
The whole thing is just… Bizarre. Something about this doesn’t ring quite true or at all sane. I mean… That drive between Dallas and El Paso? Nine hours? That’s a bitch; the last time I did that route, I was ready for a bed as soon as I hit El Paso, and this yutz is apparently going straight into “mission mode” with no rest? Who the hell does that, even in planning? I’d be unsurprised if he’d spent the night in a motel, or something, but… Apparently, he did the drive, then the shooting.
Which beggars rational explanation. I mean, even if I were to be crazy enough to want to go from Dallas to El Paso, and then kill a bunch of strangers, I’d be sensible enough to say “Yeah; better do the killing after a night’s rest… That drive is going to be tiring…”.
I want to believe the authorities, I really do… But, man, is this situation making it hard to accept a lot of what’s come out, so far.
Which reminds me of the OKC bombing, to be honest–There were things about that incident which did not make sense at all, to anyone who knew much about explosives, and it wasn’t until years later that the facts came out about what was actually done. In the meantime, because things didn’t add up, a lot of folks including myself started thinking that there were things being deliberately hidden or obscured.
Which points to very poor information management for the authorities, and an inability to grasp the essentials of how to manage things like this, in order to reduce the scope of public suspicion and enhance their own credibility.
First: Gun Free Zones should be on the hook for effective security with armed guards and metal detectors at all entrances with bonded storage so that law abiding citizens aren’t the only people disarmed.
Second: The Mexican “Foreign Minister” made one of the stupidest comments in my memory and there is a lot of competition. First Trump should tweet that twenty dead isn’t even a particularly bad day in Juarez. The State Department should summon the Ambassador and tell him to return to Mexico City until he can receive instructions from a new Foreign Minister.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/mexico-vows-take-legal-action-against-u-s-wake-deadly-n1039096
Finally: I am not going to expend even the slightest energy pursuing, reading or or even thinking about supposed manifestos. They are a sort of anti-information that annihilates real information on contact. Where anti-mater would be consumed in the encounter with mater, this stuff will emerge unscathed to continue destruction until it is completely forgotten, as should be the authors.
re:Las Vegas, also recall that ISIS claimed him immediately, and we were assured that they just do that all the time, when no one can point to a single example before or since where they falsely claimed a similar event.
They have to release the videos from the walmart or I don’t see why the eyewitnesses shouldn’t be believed.
Breivik was convicted as charged and sentenced to 21 years of preventive detention in prison, the maximum sentence allowed in Norway.
Seriously, a functioning society would have not allowed him to live. Even better, a public execution. Ok fine, the argument is that the mentally ill will not be deterred by rational signals, but as has been pointed out, these scumbags are now surrendering in order to become celebrities.
If anything public hangings will provide a reckoning for the sane citizens who are losing faith in the system. At least you can reach them.
The citizen surrenders the right of just vengeance and overall justice to the state, on the theory that the state will more fairly administer things.
When the state fails to actually administer justice, what then for that bargain?
I have the distinct impression that these rocket scientist types we have running things actually want for there to be vigilantes taking action into their own hands, for whatever reason. Because what they’re doing just does not make sense, unless they’re wanting a state of lawlessness to come about.
The compact between citizen and state needs to be enumerated and clearly spelled out, with regards to the obligations which run in both directions. If the state no longer fulfills its obligations, then the citizen no longer has need to uphold their end of the bargain, nor should they. Equality before the law is required, for things to work, and if we have no equality, we have no expectation of justice to prevail.
And, I’m afraid, that equality means that if you take a life without justification, you lose yours in turn. Anything else is madness.
Personally, I consider the Europeans to be far more barbaric than we are, here in America: In Europe, taking a life carries no commensurate penalty. They merely remove you from society, “rehabilitate” you in a comfortable facility, and then return you to commit even more crimes. Do not expect Breivik to become an enlightened citizen once he is released; you can almost guarantee he will kill again. And, of course, there are the other whom Breivik has encouraged with all this, who will kill and kill in his name.
The El Paso shootings were not related to “White Supremacy” as the Democratic media would have us believe. The socialist was horrofied by the Mexican Nationals crossing into the border cities to buy what wasn’t available at home (or at a cheaper price) thereby spinning up the economy that was despoiling the intended US site for his glorious socialist Utopia Prosperity prevents socialism, therefore the Mexican visitors shopping was an attack on his fondest dreams. I doubt if he cared that they were “Mexican” or “Hispanic”. Those “invaders” were bringing properity and destroying the little boy’s dreams of being the socialist hero living off the grid in the “pure” wild west.
Blocking Amazon from NYC probably had a similar motive. “Prosperity” would destroy the dependent population that the socialists love and worship (and collect votes from).
The damn Walmart shoppers were ruining EVERYTHING!
The Dayton shooter probably was devastated that his beloved sister was going to build a life with the man she loved and leave him in dispair.
It is all perfectly reasonable if you look from the relevant gutter or the dusty corner of the locked ward. “She/They were ruining my dream!” And it can all be justified by Social Justice Theory…… Socialism seems to have a profound appeal for the deranged.
My handle fell off the post above.
I bet some nasty socialist did it.
Mike-SMO