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  • Jeffrey Epstein’s Death in Federal Custody, the Suicide of Federal Government Credibility

    Posted by Trent Telenko on August 10th, 2019 (All posts by )

    The announced “death by suicide” of Pedo-Pimp to the Powerful Jeffrey Epstein in Federal government custody while;

    1. On a 24/7 suicide watch,
    2. After his first “suicide attempt,”  in late July, and
    3. Before there was any time for a real autopsy…

    …is such utter horse manure as to utterly destroy any shred of credibility of the Federal government.

    That Federal Attorney General Barr first called for an FBI investigation of Epstein’s death — to deafening loud round of public rasp-berry’s.

    Then he followed that credibility destroying knee jerk response near seconds later by saying the Department of Justice Inspector General would conduct the investigation — given the non-prosecution of so many in the DoJ & FBI after the IG caught them red handed leaking FISA surveillance sources and methods to the press — amounts to an “Eff-U” slap in the face to the General Public.

    This is pure “Pravda Reporting on Chernobyl” territory.  It’s all about elite posturing and “Face” while the radioactive pile burns.

    America functions on the consent of the governed.  This requires the government be credible through elite replacement by elections as well as the fair administration and enforcement of justice for both the powerful as well as the least of us.

    The circumstances of Mr Epstein’s death are such that I’ve completely lost any faith in the concept of “Justice” that in any way involves the institutional FBI or Department of Justice.

    I hate saying that because it leaves us here:

    “Those who make peaceful change impossible make violent change inevitable.”

    That Rubicon has now been crossed. G-d help the people of these United States.

    Please comment and tell me I’m wrong.  I’m in the mood to be lied too.

     

    71 Responses to “Jeffrey Epstein’s Death in Federal Custody, the Suicide of Federal Government Credibility”

    1. Trent Telenko Says:

      Iowahawk’s tweet on this is very accurate dark humor —

      David Burge
      @iowahawkblog

      Okay conspiracy kooks, I guess you win this round

      >>MSNBC
      >>@MSNBC
      >>4h
      >>
      >>BREAKING: Jeffrey Epstein was in his own cell at the time of his death,
      >>and was not on suicide watch, multiple people familiar with the investigation
      >>tell @NBCNews. (link: http://nbcnews.to/2KFA2z3) nbcnews.to/2KFA2z3
      >>
      >>10:36 AM · Aug 10, 2019·Twitter Web App

    2. Trent Telenko Says:

      A “face into the desk” comment on Epstein seen on Iowahawk’s twitter feed —

      Paul Kuster
      @Quixotes_L_S
      ·
      1h
      Replying to
      @iowahawkblog

      Alex Jones is starting to appear rational

    3. Anonymous Says:

      I’ve read several intelligent folks predict he would be killed (or kill himself) before this got deep in details. Once Buba Billy Bob Clinton’s name came up, I thought that was right. So what does Federal 24/7 suicide watch actually guarantee? Yeah, what cred.

      Death6

    4. Brian Says:

      Yes, this is legitimate pre-revolutionary stuff. No one believes this story, and once you’ve lost the public’s faith, it’s gone, and the doors are wide open. Why should we take their word for ANYTHING?

      Why shouldn’t I insist on seeing the video from the Walmart in El Paso? Why shouldn’t I believe that the multiple people who say they SAW multiple shooters are telling the truth? They don’t have any history of them lying to my face, unlike the Feds. And if I believe that the Feds would lie about this, what are the implications?

      Right now I think Americans are like the crowd at Nicolae Caeusescu’s final speech, impassively staring at our leaders, hating them, knowing they are lying vermin. It will only take the slightest push for things to go completely out of control.

    5. Grurray Says:

      It looks like the DoJ’s plan is to make this as weird and confusing as possible.

      Department of Justice spokesman Lee Plourde told The Post that Epstein, 66, was not “currently” on watch in his cell at the Metropolitan Correctional Center while he awaited trial on child sex-trafficking charges.

      They were also saying his suicide attempt last month may have been an assault instead. It’s possible they placed him in the terror block hoping he would be “Whitey Bulgered” by one of the other lunatics. He was only three cells down from El Chapo.

    6. Subotai Bahadur Says:

      Trent, we have “known” each other in passing online for quite a few years. Sorry I can’t lie to make it better.

      He was in the Special Management Unit of the Metropolitan Correctional Center. In that unit, it is required at all times that every inmate be seen as “living, breathing flesh” at least every 30 minutes. If the inmate is on suicide watch, they are required to additionally be seen every 15 minutes staggered. Those are the rules of the game.

      He was placed on suicide watch 3 weeks ago after either being attacked or committing self-harm. The question of which was not publicly confirmed. On Thursday, he was still on suicide watch, mandating that number of checks. Friday, for reasons and at a time unknown, he was taken off suicide watch. Note that being in the SMU, he still had the other checks that had to be done. British newspapers, who have to be watched but who will print news that the American media will not, have said that the cameras that were supposed to be covering the cell were “inoperative”. There are also questions that may be raised about exactly what time that he was found, and how that relates to shift changes when the oncoming shift has to make sure it has the “living, breathing flesh” it is signing off to take.

      It has been admitted by the staff involved that Friday night they did not make ANY of the required inmate checks. I know that they are Federal employees, but there is one bugger-all great number of questions that raises. Too bad that there is no one in the Federal government bureaucracy who is working for the law and the Constitution instead of for the UniParty.

      https://disq.us/url?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.reuters.com%2Farticle%2Fus-people-jeffrey-epstein%2Fdisgraced-u-s-financier-jeffrey-epstein-killed-himself-in-jail-source-idUSKCN1V00GM%3A4-kPgfEIMK4jfhhtEDLiQaJjz4A&cuid=5157233

      When you consider the huge amount of wealthy and powerful politicians, businessmen, celebrities, government officials; domestic and foreign, mostly Democrat but more than a few GOPe . . . and most of them have access to official and unofficial “coercive instruments of state power” means that his death could be accomplished by a lot of people. Payoffs and cut outs could be arranged easily.

      I am hoping [without much real hope] that Epstein left behind a mass of incriminating evidence with a “dead man switch” to take out his fellow pedophiles.

      As you know, I write in a lot of venues. By tonight I have to finish a piece I started yesterday that centers around government legitimacy and social contract. It is going to be untidy.

      There is a line from a version of the song “Jefferson and Liberty” that crosses my mind.

      The night of fire is yet to come, the Tyrant’s Shadow down the years, demands we kneel or take the gun, and go shed blood instead of our tears. Events keep pushing us in that direction. It is not a direction we want to have to go, but the options are being circumscribed.

      Subotai Bahadur

    7. Assistant Village Idiot Says:

      Background info, not making any particular point.

      By the nature of my employment fort my entire adulthood – psychiatric social worker at a state hospital, I am familiar with “suicide watch” in a psychiatric setting. Our 150-bed hospital usually has 6-10 people on what we call Level I, which is constant observation, arms reach; twice that number on Level II, constant monitoring on camera, immediate intervention if a person goes off camera or does anything odd; or Level III, 5 or 15-minute checks. I don’t know how similar this is to suicide watch in a criminal setting, but I will bet it is much more intensive with us than with them. (We have never had the impression that they cared quite as much.) For year-round staffing, each slot of 24/7 watch costs over $500,000. (Five people times true cost including benefits.) The rest are about a third of that. We are a small state, but we average about 8 + 9 + 12 slots, $6M a year, for that alone. That adds up fast and people try to avoid it. No one wants to pay that at prisons. It is also hard to do, because people who are intent on suicide have all day to think about ways to get around this, slamming themselves into bathrooms, shoving an observer aside so they can swallow something, etc.

      You learn things over time, and it is well known among us that men who have just been arrested for sexual crimes are the highest possible suicide risk, higher than people who have been through horrendous trauma or who have just lost their families horribly.

    8. Christopher B Says:

      A slightly off the wall and off tangent thought.

      They aren’t as powerful as they think they are.

      Mueller issues his report, says there’s no collusion, can’t indict on obstruction, goes down in flames in front of Congress.

      The economy, thanks frackers!, just keeps rolling along despite (or maybe because of?) trade wars.

      Slow Joe keeps coming out on top of primary polls, and they are going to have at least a dozen on stage again in September with only three drop-outs to date. Neither Harris nor Warren can get any traction because they are duking out with the other ankle-biters, and are trashing Obama’s legacy besides.

      They go after Acosta on Epstein but everybody points out he was W’s boy not Trumps, and Trump banned Epstein from his properties because he was hitting on underage girls. Bubba’s name comes up big time and people start asking questions about his involvement. Epstein is looking really really dirty (see reports that Wexner says he was conned). Suddenly Epstein isn’t so useful anymore.

      They are running scared. They are finding out they can’t really control the narrative. They thought they could coming out of 2007-2015 but Trump (and Lindsey 2.0, and Cocaine Mitch) has f’ed with their control, bigly. He drives the MSM and Leftist-hive-mind batty, and they just keep chasing those laser pointer tweets all over the floor.

      They know Barr is working on something inside DOJ just like Nunes worked his investigations. People are getting turned, are deciding it’ll be better to work with the people in power now that might still be in power in 2021. Deals are being cut and they aren’t going in the Left’s favor.

      They are scared and turning it up to 11 … then breaking off the knob. They are throwing anything against the wall to see what sticks, with no regard to what the potential blowback might be (see J Castro’s doxxing Trump donors that targeted six who donated to him and his brother, too).

      I suspect that we are in for a wild and woolly ride between now and November 2020, and maybe beyond that.

    9. Larry Says:

      I completely fail to understand just what else you expect the AG to do , Trent? Epstein was in Federal custody, was apparently not on suicide watch, and they have not announced an official cause of death because that is still pending autopsy. Obviously there needs to be a Federal investigation and that is the Federal Bureau of Investigations job. An independent IG investigation is only prudent. Do you suggest he not kick off either of those? And then everyone would be hollering about the lack of interest in finding out whst happened and screaming, “Coverup!” Other than immediately appointing a Special Counsel, what would you have him do? First rule of news is, after all, that much of the first 24 hours reporting is incorrect.

    10. Larry Says:

      Not that I have any confidence in an honest and truthful investigation that lays the cards on the table, sad to say.

    11. Trent Telenko Says:

      Subotai Bahadur,

      The Federal collapse of credibility will inevitably be followed by a collapse of legitimacy.

      You literally cannot in good conscious convict someone on evidence gathered by the FBI or other DoJ law enforcement. You cannot trust it to be the truth.

      This is what happened with the widow of the Muslim Pulse night club shooter. None of the jury believed anything the FBI provided as evidence.

      There are other much more important fall outs here.

      If there is no public justice, people will settle for the private type. Otherwise known as vengeance.

      And when, not if, we get there. No one will talk to the Feds. They’ve shown themselves to be too corrupt and too cheap at the price because they don’t know the real price of their corrupt acts.

      They will be deaf, dumb and blind in the middle of chaos.

      And the elites will suffer as well. As everyone who is not an elite will assume every elite out there are all just Epstein clients.

      Please see “private justice” again for the implications of that.

      This process will happen slowly…then all at once.

    12. MCS Says:

      I am having more and more trouble believing the narrative.

      First: Epstein was not a pedophile. All of the “victims” I’ve seen, though on the willowy side, were physically, if not mentally and legally mature.

      Second: They were all girls. If he was running some sort of vast sexual black mail apparatus, I would expect that boys would provide better leverage with those so inclined.

      Third: We are hearing everything about his proclivities. A successful pimp is all about customer satisfaction, it’s not what turns his crank that matters.

      Fourth: As far as those proclivities went, what I’m not hearing is the word intercourse or even penetration. I can’t help but think that this implies a pretty profound pathology that would be an enormous impediment to a criminal mastermind.

      Fifth: If he was gong to commit suicide, the 2008 episode would have been more plausible. He was paying a lot of people a lot of money to tell him that he would make bail. He seems too brazen to have broken in a little over a month.

      All of which proves nothing. My opinion is that Epstein was a good con man with peculiar sexual tastes that may have taken advantage of various “prominent” individuals cupidity as a form of insurance and to lure them into his power.

      As to consequences: I have the Census Population Clock open in another window. It stands at 329.5 million with another added (net) every 14 seconds. The only way the government can function is by the consent of the governed. Even if they were stupid enough to think naked coercion would work, they’ve put off recruiting the storm troops far too late and let us have far too many guns.

      They can’t even collect taxes unless the vast majority of us send the checks in without prompting. Twenty some years ago, I read an article that claimed the I.R.S. knew of five million people that were using some ruse or other to avoid withholding. They claimed that they only had the resources to go after a few thousand a year.

      It is starting to look as if the government has concluded that they no longer need to command the respect of the half of the country that they disagree with. What they fail to see is that they’ve lost the respect of the other half that are just willing to go along until their ox is gored.

    13. Anonymous Says:

      I am reminded of Whitey Bulger. At age 89, he was transferred from high-security prison Coleman II to high security prison Coleman. Within a day of his transfer, he was beaten to death.

      Bulger was transferred from the Federal Transfer Center in Oklahoma City to United States Penitentiary, Hazelton, in West Virginia on October 29, 2018.[20][94] At 8:20 a.m. on October 30, the 89-year-old Bulger[95] was found unresponsive in the prison. Bulger was in a wheelchair and had been beaten to death by multiple inmates armed with a sock-wrapped padlock and a shiv. His eyes had nearly been gouged out and his tongue almost cut off.[96][97][98] This was the third homicide at the prison in a 40-day span.[99] Correctional officers had warned Congress just days before the most recent Hazelton death that facilities were being dangerously understaffed.[97] Massachusetts-based mafia hitman Fotios “Freddy” Geas is the primary suspect in orchestrating the killing of Bulger and he has not disputed his role.[96][100][101] Geas, 51, and his brother were sentenced to life in prison in 2011 for their roles in several violent crimes, including the 2003 killing of Adolfo “Big Al” Bruno, a Genovese crime family boss who was shot in a Springfield, Massachusetts, parking lot.

      What was the point of moving him from one high security prison to another, especially when he was being moved to an understaffed, dangerous prison? It looks to me that the fix was on. Not that Whitey was a nice guy we should mourn for, but he should have been able to serve out his sentence in peace and live a natural death.

      I am also reminded that the FBI has blood on its hands for its many years of coddling Whitey Bulger,an FBI informant who took advantage of his position to get underworld rivals put away- while he was doing some of his own killing. Does Robert Mueller ring a bell?

    14. Gringo Says:

      That was me.

    15. John Henry Says:

      Why do we think he is not alive and well? Because the media tells us he’s dead? Because the government tells us he’s dead?

      Please.

      I can’t think of 4 entities with motive and means to pretend he is dead to get him out.

      US GOVT to transfer him to some secret, more protected location

      Mossad

      Clintons et al to prevent him talking. Dead does that but he may have set up a dead man’s switch. They would need to find out and stop it before killing him.

      The royal family to protect Andrew and the crown.

      Epstein himself with outside help.

      We need to see “the body in the box” before I’m 100% convinced he is dead.

      Someone may be dead but it may not be epstein

      It truly does stink.

      John Henry

    16. Tom Holsinger Says:

      Two comments.

      The prison staff here could have been blackmailed by threats against their families instead of being bribed.

      Two more people involved are at major risk of dying in the next 2-3 weeks. Those are Epstein’s first cellmate, and the staffer who told the night guards not to make the SOP periodic checks on Epstein that evening. Possibly also whoever was supposed to make certain the cell cameras were functioning.

    17. MCS Says:

      This is all so clumsy. I commented on another thread that the easiest way to get rid of him was to bail him. He’d be in some non-extradition jurisdiction before you could say Jack Robinson. Of course, once there, he might find out the down side, or maybe not; if it was a clean head shot. Makes the suicide angle look even worse, I’m sure he had it explained that it would take a little time to have a more credulous judge take over the case.

    18. Subotai Bahadur Says:

      Trent, I absolutely agree with your comment and expect the same things, with additional triggers that may make things get kinetic quicker. We are, right this minute, in the process of “othering” the different nations inside our borders. Those nations, maybe 3 or 4 depending on how you count them, are not compatible. They do not believe in the same things, have the same thought processes, have wildly different cultures, and really no longer understand each other in any meaningful way.

      Every nation, de jure or de facto, has its own mechanism to resolve differences, and allocate power and rewards as they conceive them. While in general de jure nations are theoretically conceived of as being “equal”; in fact each is a product of the people, culture, history, language, faith system [or lack thereof], and economy of that nation’s, all the factors interacting. That system can be referred to as the nation’s politics. Because all of the originating factors are different, each political system is different and they are not interchangeable or compatible at random. We are close to the British, but no way would their politics work here, nor ours there.

      The one way, with historical examples everywhere, that politics across nations ARE identical is expressed in an axiom of Clausewitz:

      War is merely a continuation of Politics by other means.

      When a sufficient fraction of the population of a nation loses faith in the legitimacy and reality of the political system of their nation as a means of resolving those differences or allocating power and rewards; the only other alternative is violence and war until one side or the other prevails. There is no magical process of pulling a miracle out of a fundamental orifice, or waving a magic wand. One side or the other has to defeat the other sufficiently to silence or destroy them. Because neither side can trust the other on the basis of shared values or a social contract any more.

      With the Left calling for and extolling violence and death for anyone who they oppose or who will not submit to them, and our government functioning as if they believe the Constitution is a work of fiction, the time of separation from the “other” is upon us. With the prospect of a multi-sided SACW following. It would be a good thing to be surrounded by like-minded people when the organic waste impacts the rotating airfoil.

      Subotai Bahadur

    19. Grurray Says:

      I am also reminded that the FBI has blood on its hands for its many years of coddling Whitey Bulger,an FBI informant

      They didn’t just coddle Bulger, but top agents in the New England FBI were on his payroll and controlled by him. The story is that Bulger was going to name names just before he was transferred. Robert Mueller, who was US attorney in Boston during that time, was going to be implicated.

      The fact is that the integrity of the FBI has been suspect for a long time.

    20. Brian Says:

      Bulger was straight out murdered by the Feds, there’s no other way to interpret that.

      To be consistent with their current style guides, the media should be writing “Government claims, without evidence, Epstein commits suicide” or even better, “Government claims, without evidence, Epstein dead.”

      At this point if there should be video and there’s not, I’m not going to believe the government story. So we’ve got Epstein, El Paso, Las Vegas. Hell, why shouldn’t I add Osama to the list?

      Once you believe one insane thing, it’s kind of hard to stop.

    21. Anonymous Says:

      Grurray,

      The FBI has not just been corrupt for a long time (100 years is a long time, right?) it was born corrupt. It was created by Woodrow Wilson for corrupt purposes.

      Under Hoover (almost 50) years the main function of leadership was to cultivate an image of integrity and hide any instances of corruption. It was nothing more than image control.

      It’s been corrupt from the git-go

      John Henry

    22. Mike K Says:

      I am getting the “Pravda reports on Chernobyl” feeling.

      Earlier this morning, I looked at the Orange County Register article on why OC has gone “blue.” The comments are dominated by three leftist commenter who ridicule the idea that “Ballot Harvesting” could be a factor.

      Ballot harvesting was also used in Arizona and states with “mail-in” ballots are an invitation. I expect it to be used next year in the national election.

      I hear that the Arizona legislature is considering Voter ID of some sort. I hope so.

      The left has discovered that voters are not buying what they are selling. The desire to cheat is overwhelming.

    23. Trent Telenko Says:

      >>I completely fail to understand just what else you expect the
      >>AG to do , Trent? Epstein was in Federal custody, was apparently
      >>not on suicide watch, and they have not announced an official
      >>cause of death because that is still pending autopsy

      What AG Barr could have done but did not.

      1. After the first reported “suicide attempt” Barr should have sent a special detachment of about 10 Law enforcement people personally trusted by him to ghost the 24/7 surveillance of Epstein with one of his own.

      He didn’t, Epstein expired with no evidence how.

      2. After Epstein’s supposed suicide, Barr could have appointed an independent prosecutor with real gravitas to deal with this.

      He didn’t. We have been given the non-credible IG Horowitz.

      3. AG Barr could have resigned over his failure…aww hell, who am I kidding here.

      Prediction based on #3 — Some time in the next 3-months all investigations/prosecutions related to Epstein will be dropped because the tapes/digital media seized from Horowitz will be destroyed/turn up missing.

      Additionally, per Tom Holsinger, several people involved with the monitoring of Epstein will expire under various non-believable circumstances.

    24. Brian Says:

      Trent: To be fair to Barr, at this point we can’t rule out that Epstein isn’t dead, but has been spirited away somewhere to keep him safe, or something equally bizarre. It’s no stupider than the notion that he committed suicide.

    25. Trent Telenko Says:

      MCS Said:

      >>I am having more and more trouble believing the narrative.

      That’s because the “narrative” on Epstein is another “Pravda reporting on Chernobyl” moment.

      The pattern that fairly jumped out for me regards Epstein is that he was in no way, shape, or form be a trader in the financial markets.

      He was some sort of information broker using his underage perv-network — insert theories as to how here — as a source of “insider information.”

      The upshot: I think the people paying Epstein money for “trades” are actually paying him off for “insider information”; either as extortion victim or as users of his information.

      Given Epstein’s longevity, I’d say many of the people paying Epstein are converted to insider trading extortion victims.

      This “insider information corruption script” strongly suggests that the pillars of Wall Street are dirty here.

      Too include some numbers of people in the Federal government’s financial regulatory system and the Federal Reserve who have been sitting on insider information investigations of Epstein.

      If this is logical thought stream is true. Then Epstein’s real role in the financial ecosystem was an “open secret” to the “one tenth of one percent” who knew Epstein’s underage sex party trader exterior was a public layer false identity of an “onion” covering his real income stream.

      If this logical train of thought is correct, I wonder when Pres. Donald Trump found out?

      It was certainly after he kicked Epstein out of Mar-a-Lago, but before he became president.

    26. Strelnikov Says:

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcSYdyTVVX8

    27. dmv gringo Says:

      No, Trent, I’m not going to lie, you’re irrevocably correct.
      Enjoy. Toddles.

    28. Mark Matis Says:

      Never ever forget:

      There are no “good cops”.

    29. Mike K Says:

      Too bad 8Chan has been shut down. Maybe they could come up with an explanation.

      Wait…. Hmm.

    30. PenGun Says:

      Zero Hedge had plane numbers and their departure time to Israel. There was much madness about the internet and I was amused. This was obviously gonna happen given how deep he goes.

    31. Anonymous Says:

      The great theorist Claude Shannon back in the post-WWII days provided the basis for much of our modern communication infrastructure. Part of his idea was that information told us something we did not already know. By that standard, the “suicide” of Mr. Epstein is not information.

      We already knew that the Clintons have been corrupt grifters since their earliest days. We knew that Bill Clinton has been credibly accused of rape — and did not get the Kavanaugh treatment. We knew that we are not allowed to know anything about Barry Soetero’s background that has not been officially scrubbed clean. We knew that a senior IRS employee could illegally abuse her position to wage a private war on the TEA Party, and retire unprosecuted on fat benefits. We knew that no government official ever paid a price for Ruby Ridge or for Waco. We knew that Muller’s “investigation” of alleged Russian influence was a partisan effort funded by unwilling taxpayers. We knew that the Supreme Court routinely ignores the explicit language of the 10th Amendment.

      Sad to say, the Epstein story simply confirms what we already knew — the government we supposedly elect and the civil servants who supposedly work for us have become untrustworthy parasites on the nation. Ross Perot’s trade-related “giant sucking sound” is transforming into the sound of the Mandate of Heaven being withdrawn from the Political Class.

    32. Gavin Longmuir Says:

      Sorry, that above was me — again.

    33. Trent Telenko Says:

      I’ve found this twitter thread the best one stop information kiosk for the circumstances of Epstein’s death:

      Roscoe B Davis🎖⭐️⭐️⭐️
      @RoscoeBDavis1
      Career LEO-Vet-Constitutional Conservative-Pragmatist – One Riot One Ranger #AmericaFirst #BackTheBlue #IStandWithFlynn The Facts Matter
      Aug. 10, 2019
      https://threader.app/thread/1160181168131792896

    34. Dan from Madison Says:

      I read somewhere that there was a video camera “malfunction”. That was the straw that broke this camels back. Even my local quick mart has functioning cameras, as does practically every other place of business you enter. For a jail (of all places) with highly dangerous/valuable prisoners to have a video “malfunction” is a total farce. Hoping that someone leaks the video that they surely have eventually.

    35. Trent Telenko Says:

      This Twitcy thread is well worth reading regards the MSM’s “It’s Conspiracy Theory” credibility collapse.

      https://twitchy.com/samj-3930/2019/08/11/the-mic-has-been-dropped-mollie-hemingway-owns-cnns-jim-sciutto-for-complaining-about-epstein-conspiracy-theories/

      and this tweet from it sums it up nicely:

      The Doctor
      @TennantRob
      Replying to @MZHemingway @Debbie22210

      Trust is a fragile commodity. Difficult to build, and as fragile as a dewdrop on a leaf. Our politicians and media personalities run it through a chipper shredder.

      15
      8:03 AM – Aug 11, 2019

    36. Major1 Says:

      THIS is when you lost faith in the credulity of our federal government?
      You must have been in a coma for the last 30 years.

    37. Trent Telenko Says:

      Major1 Said:

      >>THIS is when you lost faith in the credulity of our federal government?
      >>You must have been in a coma for the last 30 years.

      Orders of magnitude mean things. It is one thing to horse laugh at “I’m here from the government. I’m here to help you.”, which has been around since Pres. Ronald Reagan used it as a line in his 1984 re-election campaign.

      It is quite another to be publicly laying down markers against future events — via well known public corruption behavior templates — on who the next murder will be in an on-going Federal government criminal conspiracy.

      A conspiracy that is -succeeding- in destroying the records and killing the people involving the sexual perversions of a past US President, the British Royal family, many past & current Wall Street “Masters of the Universe,” most of Hollywood, plus currently serving members of the Congressional and Executive branches of the Federal government, as well as Federal Reserve.

      That is a horridly bad telenovela plot that happen’s to be the current, accurate, description of America’s ruling political, cultural and financial elites.

      Welcome to the United States of Banana Republic.

    38. Rufus Says:

      The Pilgrims Society

    39. MCS Says:

      If “their” aim was to make this go away, they missed. What we have instead is something that will come up regularly for the next 50 years.

      We know Epstein is dead, maybe. Everything else is a leak. The pictures that Trent pointed us to do not show an individual in the full bloom of health.

      I think I might give it a couple of days before I declare the Constitution a dead letter and head for the hills.

      Follow the money. It had to come from somewhere. I suspect a straight con similar to Madoff. There seems to be an infinite supply of credulous people with lots of money. As for the political angle, since when hasn’t the smell of money spiced with a private jet been more than enough to attract more politicians than vultures to a three day old carcass?

      If someone was running some sort of sex sting against the rich and well connected, would they trust it to a bunch of High School girls barely old enough to drive? How likely is that if there was a large number of these girls deployed against a large number of well known targets, that there would be only one of them making charges? So far, there are a few names and one picture of poor Prince Andrew. What this proves, other than the Royal Family needs to employ better minders, I don’t know. I would have thought that the targets would have more refined tastes in perversion than could be satisfied by novice amateurs. If there’s one thing the Kraft bust proves, it’s that being a billionaire is less fun than I imagined.

      The 2008 deal stands out like a sore thumb. Who knew that Florida jails had private wings with valet jailers? There has to be something there but I can’t guess what it is. It might be something as simple as com men are good at conning people and prosecutors are not immune. In fact, the FBI and DEA seem to be particularly susceptible. Always willing to forego the bird in the hand for someone higher in an organization that sometimes doesn’t exist.

      I see a lot of pieces, what I can’t figure is how many puzzles there are. These pieces don’t seem to want to fall into any kind of pattern.

      The frustration of Russiagate or whatever you want to call it, isn’t the impenetrable conspiracy, it’s the totally transparent and infantile nature of the machinations that has succeeded in tying the country in knots to this day. We seem to be governed by the Keystone Cops which I find more frightening than the alternative.

    40. Junkyard Dog Says:

      Distinction — suicide versus murdered. Probably he was PERMITTED, or rather induced or coerced, to commit suicide, by threats to himself and/or to others he cares about. Then it is a matter of briefly lowering the anti-suicide defenses and/or facilitating the suicide during that window. There is then always a prima facie case that the whole thing was just a regrettable lapse. Only an admission by someone complicit would prove that Epstein’s death was intended and facilitated by others. Plain fact however now is that virtually everyone believes that Epstein was, one way or another, killed by powerful people to protect themselves, and that he was killed with the implicit or active cooperation of the law enforcement machine. Odds are that obvious intuition is correct. Sometimes conspiracies are real. Confirmation or disconfirmation is unlike ever to be definitive. Thus this episode will fester. This is a milestone in public awareness that government power in the USA is now a hostile force accountable only to itself, and not to any law, or to any democratically elected executive, or to any concept of legality. That is a very dangerous thing for people to believe — especially since it is increasingly obvious that it is true. The USA is in a state of severe regime decay. The rot has become a threat to our basic liberties and to our wellbeing as a society and our security. Long-standing structural members which look solid may fail catastrophically and with little warning when the rot is this deep. I’d much prefer not to be living in such interesting times, but I didn’t get to pick.

    41. Gavin Longmuir Says:

      Major1 does have a point. When we think about all the unacceptable abuses that have functionally been accepted in recent years — from Fast & Furious to Hillary’s open bathroom e-mail server to Muller — why should the Epstein story be any different? A few headlines, a couple of weeks discussion, and then forgotten.

      Maybe this story will last longer than others because of the prurient sex angle — but what should we as citizens be more concerned about: Politicians have sex with willing well-compensated young women? Or politicians destroying our economy and ruining our children’s future by spending money they don’t have and regulating industries out of the US?

      And if we citizens decided that enough was enough, what could we do about it? Vote Republican?????? In the absence of a near-miraculous appearance of a new social & political mass movement that destroyed both existing political parties, nuked the Swamp, and cut government down to a small fraction of its current size & scope, there is no peaceful way out of this morass. The probability is a future very unpleasant collapse of the current Western “democratic” system, not just in the US. The major question is — When?

    42. Anonymous Says:

      Gavin Longmuir Says:
      August 11th, 2019 at 4:09 pm
      …In the absence of a near-miraculous appearance of a new social & political mass movement…

      Washington, Lincoln, Roosevelt, Chuchill,… The world has gone to Hell many, many times. “Then a hero comes along…”. Maybe Orange is the new…

    43. Junkyard Dog Says:

      This is pretty convincing.

    44. Phil Ossiferz Stone Says:

      I’ll just lay this out for anyone who may be listening and may have been fence sitting, because it continues to surprise me how many people prophesy total collapse and disaster and kinetic-fiscal-social meltdown without even bothering to exercise their 2nd Amendment rights while they remain mostly untrammeled.

      Now is the time to get off your ass and build an AR-15 for yourself and every child you have or hope to have. You still have a year — and hopefully five — to stock up. Get a couple of stripped lower receivers while you’re at it. An extra spring set is cheap insurance against any long-term failure, as is an extra set of gas rings. Avoid carbines; they have chamber pressures twice as high as rifles, and in its original configuration with a rifle length gas system Gene Stoner’s rifle is still nice and light. A compact cleaning kit and all your extra doo-dads can be stored in an M-16A2 type rifle stock.

      Stock up on mags, as they will eventually wear out or get damaged and are semi-expendable. The Surefeed USGI mags by OKAY Indistries are the gold standard. Magpuls are also good. You ought to have about a dozen, to dispense to friends or use for barter. A six-magazine USGI bandolier can be had on eBay for ten dollars. Everything else you need can go in a fanny pack. You do not need a freaking plate carrier or helmet or harness or other paramilitary impedimenta. You are not a soldier and are not going to be engaging in open battle if you have any smarts.

      Use Gunbot to find cheap ammo. Brass will be worth its weight in gold to reloaders, so avoid the poly/steel cased stuff and use a brass catcher. Remember all that stockpiled ammo is useless unless you put it on stripper clips and have a few charging spoons handy. A gang of spics or nignogs or tweakers is not going to agree to a time-out so you can reload your mags one fumbling freaking cartridge at a time. For long-term storage, use GI ammo cans with a silica dessicant pack thrown in. Tape the charging spoons to the inside of the lid so you don’t have to scrabble around looking for them. Five hundred rounds will see you through years of trouble. The rest is for practice, without which those five hundred rounds are useless.

      You will need a simple adjustable two-point sling. The IDF issue ones are wide and comfortable and are cheap enough. Get an IDF issue magazine holder while you’re at it; it is a good way to store a loaded magazine on your weapon and have it instantly ready for use. Zahal.org has both.

      You do not need a tacticool red dot scope. It is one more thing to fail or that needs batteries. Get a plain old fixed- or low- power scope like grampa has on his deer rifle and practice practice practice. The Burris 2×7 and Nikon 223 x3 are both excellent and will take plenty of abuse. Flip-up scope covers will keep rain and dirt off the optics.

      That’ll getcha started. *Then* you can get back to grousing on the Internet about things that stopped being under your control a long time ago, in a country where a hundred thousand invaders continue to flood across the border without resistance every month.

    45. Trent Telenko Says:

      We have another name in to add to the “pending Epstein case suicide” list — Ghislaine Maxwell.

      See the link:

      https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7347091/RICHARD-PENDLEBURY-Robert-Maxwells-daughter-spill-paedophile-Jeffrey-Epsteins-secrets.html

    46. Larry Says:

      @Trent, fair enough on Barr. I was thinking of post-demise actions regarding Epstein, but the demise should never have happened.

    47. Mike K Says:

      For a jail (of all places) with highly dangerous/valuable prisoners to have a video “malfunction” is a total farce. Hoping that someone leaks the video that they surely have eventually.

      Whitey Bulger was wheeled (wheelchair) to an area that was not covered by the CCTV cameras and murdered a few minutes after he arrived. One eye was cuit out asm a message. They know exactly where the cameras are and what is covered. But who is “They?”

    48. Jonathan Says:

      Good comment, Phil.

    49. Mike K Says:

      Phil, my son has two he built and I have one. Also mags. For his birthday, I gave him a case of ammo. He is in CA, so that was welcome.

      Somebody mentioned 2008 in connection with Epstein. There is a lot about 2008 we don’t know and not just about Epstein.

      This talk by Steve Bannon at Oxford is worth watching.

    50. rayward Says:

      Justice can be carried out by private parties or by the militia; formal government is not required, particularly when the formal government has conspicuously failed. We are the people. If we require justice be done, it will be. The hirelings of government, our creation, may not share our commitments.

    51. The Demon Slick Says:

      Epstein was extortion inc. He was done in by murder inc. Different branches of the same organization.

    52. Anonymous Says:

      Gavis asked “Politicians have sex with willing well-compensated young women? ”

      It is not the women part of that that is troublesome. It is the young part. Young as in under 18.

      This is especially true if Epstein was running a honeypot/extortion scheme.

      If Prince Andrew, or Bill Clinton, or any of the others gets caught with a nubile 21 year old, it is embarassing but that is all. It might be worth something to keep it hidden but not a lot. Maybe nothing in some cases. “Hilary knows I cat around. It is worth nothing to me for you not to tell her.”

      But catch them with a 16 year old and a whole slew of laws kicks in, most of them resulting in serious jail time.

      The extortion, if that is what it was, only works if the girls are underage.

      John Henry

    53. Junkyard Dog Says:

      Vulgar but accurate.

    54. ray ward Says:

      Phil,

      Thanks for the advice. Hadn’t been to Gunbot in ages.

    55. Jimmy the Saint Says:

      “Please comment and tell me I’m wrong. I’m in the mood to be lied too.”

      You are in error. No one is screaming.
      – The Computer (from Paranoia)

    56. Gavin Longmuir Says:

      John Henry: “It is not the women part of that that is troublesome. It is the young part. Young as in under 18.”

      The problem is that our politicians (mere human beings) arbitrarily decided that females are mature enough to choose if they want to engage in sex at the age of 18; but they are not mature enough to choose if they want to have a drink before sex until they are 21. And they are mature enough to choose they want an abortion no matter how young their age, apparently. Politicians have passed nonsensical laws! If Prince Andrew pays $10,000 to a woman who is 18 years & 1 day old to have sex, that is ok; but if she is 17 years & 11 months old, it is not?

      It may be disheartening, but today’s reality is that many females are sexually active from about the age of 15 onwards. Historically, many young women were married by the time they were 16. And at the other end of the scale, we have all met 35 year old women who really should not be allowed out on their own. Maturity is rather poorly correlated to chronological age.

      Having said that the “law” is arbitrary and stupid, yes I agree that the nation’s laws should be obeyed. That is why Chrissie Ford should not have broken the law by drinking as a teenager. That is why Hillary Clinton should not have broken the law with her home-brew e-mail server distributing classified material to who-knows-whom. Yet in those cases, laws were broken with impunity, and the women who broke the laws were not even charged with their crimes. It is hard to get excited about someone paying a willing teenager for sex in a country where the powerful & the privileged routinely flout the laws with no consequences.

      While President, Bill Clinton used his position of authority to entice a young female employee into granting sexual favors in the workplace. He then lied about what he had done. And he remained President. Why would we expect Bill Clinton to be worried now about legal consequences from having had sex years ago with a well-paid teenage prostitute?

    57. MCS Says:

      I’m pretty sure that legal jeopardy would depend on being able to prove that the perpetrator knew that the victim was under age. Just from looking at the only picture that I’ve seen of one of the victims, 15-16 I think at the time, I could believe that she was anywhere up to her early twenties. In person, easier and for some people that are better observers, maybe obvious but still pretty hard to prove under these circumstances.

      If Epstein paid, prostitution probably doesn’t apply either. Hell, in as much as they may have been recorded performances, the porn exception might apply to the participants while Epstein and Maxwell would be on the hook for kiddy porn violations. I don’t expect that will give much relief to the minds of the performers.

    58. andrewdb Says:

      Statutory rape is not an “intent” crime. It is “strict liability.” Always insist on seeing ID if you are tempted to do anything with someone on the younger side!

    59. Clark Says:

      Note that checking ID is not a defense. So be sure that the ID is not fake.

    60. Trent Telenko Says:

      One of my private e-mail lists surface the “non-news” that several “assassination contracts” — the largest at $22 million and the sum total was $500 million — were let for the death of Epstein.

      I am placing this in the “rumor control” category until I see more, but whether it is true or not, Federal law enforcement will be watching and comparing wealth versus tax returns of everyone in the NY City detention center staff _forever_.

    61. miguel cervantes Says:

      mind you this fellow is all on the my Russia track, but he’s turned up some interesting details, about epsteins partner,

      http://fraudbusterbob.org/blog/2010/03/09/bob-bytes-back-archive-71698-the-shapiro-murder-file/

      he’s gone far afield into christics territory,

    62. Gavin Longmuir Says:

      Trent T: “… Federal law enforcement will be watching and comparing wealth versus tax returns of everyone in the NY City detention center staff _forever_.”

      You mean, like, the FBI and the IRS? The same FBI and IRS that have done — oh well, you know. Can you understand why I am not impressed?

      And even if the Federal government were competent enough to do this (more competent, say, than other government entities are in looking after prisoners), would you be in the least surprised if the only people ever prosecuted turned out to have R after their names?

      Nope! Credibility of government and all its agencies has left the building.

    63. Subotai Bahadur Says:

      Trent T: “… Federal law enforcement will be watching and comparing wealth versus tax returns of everyone in the NY City detention center staff _forever_.”

      You still, apparently, have some faith in the government to act lawfully. Right now one of the best bets in the midst of this is that at least a major fraction of Federal law enforcement was ankle deep [and in head first] in this contract hit. I don’t know who was ultimately behind it [too many plausible suspects of all nationalities] but Federal BOP has to be part of it, and presumably other parts of LEA’s. If they are the source of the wealth, or if the wealth is funneled through a plausibly legal means [What do you mean you won Publisher’s Clearing House Sweepstakes?] that ain’t gonna mean a thing.

      I find it interesting that after a month, today FINALLY 8 FBI agents did a well publicized landing on Pedo Island. For the last month, everything on that island has been being sanitized, and buildings have literally been dismantled and removed. Various Blogs and websites have been running drones over the island and the progress of the removal has been put online. Eight FBI agents, and no evidence techs mean they are doing bloody well nothing. My guess is that the sanitization crew is done, and the FBI is checking their work. They may issue a “nothing here to see” statement. But what basis is there to trust any statement they make?

      But until we see the parties involved in the molestations/rapes AND those who covered it up being Put To The Question in the Spanish sense, there is no trust of the Left and none for most of the Right. And I might be too optimistic with that.

      Subotai Bahadur

    64. Brian Says:

      re: the FBI “raid” on Pedo Island, the drone footage posted to YouTube is quite odd–why did no one do that before? Nothing about it makes any sense, because we’re only seeing shadows, not the actual events that are going on deep beneath the surface.

    65. Trent Telenko Says:

      Regards these statement:

      >>You still, apparently, have some faith in the government to act lawfully. Right now one of the best bets in the midst of this is that at least a major fraction of Federal law enforcement was ankle deep [and in head first] in this contract hit.

      >>You mean, like, the FBI and the IRS? The same FBI and IRS that have done — oh well, you know. Can you understand why I am not impressed?

      Its about sharing the money, not the crime.

      The IRS will want their cut of the ‘assassination lotto’ winnings.

    66. Trent Telenko Says:

      Regards this —

      >> I don’t know who was ultimately behind it [too many plausible suspects of all nationalities] but Federal BOP has to be part of it, and presumably other parts of LEA’s. If they are the source of the wealth, or if the wealth is funneled through a plausibly legal means…

      The usual reward for a successful assassin of a high profile political target is a metaphorical bullet to the back of the head and an unmarked grave.

      It’s safer for the people who hired the assassin(s).

      This is why I’me expecting a lot of “death by misadventure” with many close to the process of administering Epstein’s NY City cell in the Bureau of Prisons.

    67. Trent Telenko Says:

      It looks like Epstein’s neck was broken via strangulation rather than hanging.

      See:

      Epstein Autopsy Reportedly Shows Broken Neck Bones More Consistent With Homicide Than Suicide
      By ELLIOT HANNON

      AUG 15, 2019

      https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2019/08/epstein-autopsy-broken-neck-bones-more-consistent-homicide-suicide-strangulation.html

      “The autopsy conducted in the wake of Jeffrey Epstein’s death by apparent suicide shows the financier suffered multiple breaks in his neck bones, which while possible during instances of suicidal hanging, the Washington Post reports, is more commonly found in homicide victims of strangulation.”

    68. MCS Says:

      Neck bones are something you use for soup. It proves that if the article is based on the actual report, it is being filtered through someone with even less knowledge of anatomy than I have, or someone that hasn’t actually seen the report. I find it impossible to tell if it means that the hyoid was was broken in several places or if different bones were also broken. What other information I’ve read shows wildly variable differences in how often the hyoid bone is broken in hanging between studies. Epstein was old and brittle.

      Probably a little premature to make any conclusion until the actual report is out and can speak for itself. And when it is, there will be no shortage of actual forensic pathologists to provide knowledgeable interpretations.

    69. Michael G. Gallagher Says:

      Maybe General Mattis will come out retirement and with his friends save us chaos of a second civil war, and then pull a Cincinnatus. You know this has been talked about quietly in his circles.

    70. Jon Davies Says:

      Does anyone ever think we will get a definitive view of what happened?

    71. Brian Says:

      Mr Davies: “They” decided we weren’t entitled to any explanation about the Las Vegas shooter, and they got away with that, so why should this be any different.

      Also, they’re never going to try to explain why multiple people said they SAW multiple shooters in the El Paso Walmart either.