The headline at the Drudge Report says it all — MOHAMED AND HIS TRUCK.
A Tunisian born Muslim with French citizenship took a box truck and ran over hundreds during the annual French Bastille Day celebrations in NICE, Southern France.
The UK Daily mail article at this link —
…said that Mohamed Lahouaiej Bouhlel drank alcohol, ate pork, chased women at night clubs, beat his wife and took drugs. He was a petty criminal, publicly violent, and possibly an informant for French police or internal security forces before he was turned into a suicide-murderer by those who he was spying on, according to David P. Goldman of the Asia Times.
See Goldman’s article titled:
WHY THE TERRORISTS ARE WINNING THE INTELLIGENCE WAR
http://atimes.com/2016/07/why-the-terrorists-are-winning-the-intelligence-war/
The only thing of importance in all of this is the realization that the law enforcement and internal security forces in the West have lost control. No amount of law enforcement, electronic surveillance or gun control can prevent a suicide-murderer bent on religious self-immolation, and activated by the ongoing world wide social media incitement campaign(s), from killing dozens to hundreds.
What cannot go on, won’t.
Goldman suggests in his article that a General Sherman “March Through Georgia” style of collective punishment of Muslim civilian populations in the West can work to end this random death in the Western civilization’s life support.
The bottom line — as BREXIT proved — is that publics in Western democracies can and will replace elites that say nothing can be done, and that Western publics “…will have to accept more Muslim Mass Immigration & Terrorism, because… (insert P. C. excuse here)”.
Discuss.
There’s a limit – and it is closer to being reached than most transnational progressive elites and our national media will admit. There is a great deal of fury building up; not just people sick and tired of Islamic-inspired terror, but of half a dozen other issues. Criminal illegal aliens repeatedly committing all kinds of mayhem, from identity theft to uninsured drunk driving, rape and murder — and yet appearing to be sheltered by our political elite classes and self-nominated activists. Then there is the national media shoving instances of “polar bear hunting” under the rug, not to mention truly horrific incidents of black on white crime, while devoting screaming headlines to the comparative handful of white police-on-thug-of-color deaths. Federal agencies being weaponized, politicised, and used as a club against ordinary citizens on a purely partisan basis. So many instances of thinks like it being AOK for men who identify as women to use female dressing rooms, changing rooms, bathrooms – where to the feewings of an almost invisible minority trump the safety issue? I have the sense that people are being almost deliberately pushed on so many fronts; is it just ham-handed high-mindedness of the Ruling Class, or are they actively trying to goad ordinary citizens into rebelling?
There’s a limit – and it is closer to being reached than most transnational progressive elites and our national media will admit. There is a great deal of fury building up; not just people sick and tired of Islamic-inspired terror, but of half a dozen other issues. Criminal illegal aliens repeatedly committing all kinds of mayhem, from identity theft to uninsured drunk driving, rape and murder — and yet appearing to be sheltered by our political elite classes and self-nominated activists. Then there is the national media shoving instances of “polar bear hunting” under the rug, not to mention truly horrific incidents of black on white crime, while devoting screaming headlines to the comparative handful of white police-on-thug-of-color deaths. Federal agencies being weaponized, politicised, and used as a club against ordinary citizens on a purely partisan basis. So many instances – like it being AOK for men who identify as women to use female dressing rooms, changing rooms, bathrooms – where to the feewings of an almost invisible minority trump the safety issue? I have the sense that people are being almost deliberately pushed on so many fronts; is it just ham-handed high-mindedness of the Ruling Class, or are they actively trying to goad ordinary citizens into rebelling?
You beat me to it. I was about to post Spengler’s column and link, as well, to Flynn’s explanation for his retirement from DIA.
Two years ago, I was called into a meeting with the undersecretary of defense for intelligence and the director of national intelligence, and after some “niceties,” I was told by the USDI that I was being let go from DIA. It was definitely an uncomfortable moment (I suspect more for them than me).
I asked the DNI (Gen. James Clapper) if my leadership of the agency was in question and he said it was not; had it been, he said, they would have relieved me on the spot.
I knew then it had more to do with the stand I took on radical Islamism and the expansion of al Qaeda and its associated movements. I felt the intel system was way too politicized, especially in the Defense Department. After being fired, I left the meeting thinking, “Here we are in the middle of a war, I had a significant amount of combat experience (nearly five years) against this determined enemy on the battlefield and served at senior levels, and here it was, the bureaucracy was letting me go.” Amazing.
Trump needs to make this guy head of DHS. After all, it is our “Homeland Security” that is at stake.
Goldman’s article is excellent as is Michael Walsh’s. Anytime someone brings up Sherman in relation to this conflict, it’s a sign of progress.
No one will kill a large number of people unless they have a very good reason. It’s god again this time, and he has been the major motivation for pretty well all the death and destruction in the middle east.
The real reasons for these conflicts do not concern us here. The reasons given by the perpetrators of all these monstrous crimes is god wanted them to do it.
An ancient patriarchal control mechanism, god, is the foundation of the problems we have today. Maybe it’s time we grew up? Nah, crazy talk.
Shut up Pennie.
Definitely deliberate provocation and incitement. Although the game has been on for years, one could say that the 2008 was a pushing of the accelerator down. The birth certificate issue, a prime example. Get ’em worked up. Right up to the present, with the insulting and disrespectful lecture at the Dallas Massacre memorial. Keep pushing until you get a negative reaction. Whether it’s the street corner or the oval office. We’re taught that socialism is something obscure, that really never existed and certainly not here. That needs to change.
“I have the sense that people are being almost deliberately pushed on so many fronts; is it just ham-handed high-mindedness of the Ruling Class, or are they actively trying to goad ordinary citizens into rebelling?”
Sgt. Mom, I have that same sense but a slightly different (and arguably more paranoid) interpretation. I don’t think the Ruling Class expects to provoke rebellion; I think they’re pushing to make ordinary citizens deny common sense and their own experience in favor of their preferred narrative. Make people afraid to dissent openly and over time it will become more and more difficult for them to dissent even in the privacy of their own thoughts.
Embedding the preferred narrative in the language is just one of the tools for crushing independent thought, but it’s a very powerful one. Look at the magically invented new pronouns. Anybody who actually uses “ze, zir, zem” with a straight face has already conceded his mind to our new overlords.
That’s the role of all good propaganda, Marge. To ridicule and silence.
I wrote this awhile back, but if we study Islam none of wATS HAPPENING should surprise us..
This is what I think about Muhammed/Islam and you can decide whether I’m “vilifying” them.
But, remember, to “vilify” someone, what you say has to be untrue. It’s not vilification if it’s the truth.
I am just a guy on a message board reporting on what I have found. I know a few people here would like to think I’m advocating hatred, but I’m not. They just don’t like what I have to say, that’s all. Well, life is rough all around, I guess. Personally, I think Christ got it right, and he transcended hatred. I, on the other hand, am just an imperfect, unenlightened sinner, but I do deeply believe that the truth will set you free, so that’s my quest. Pretty simple, really.
So, as for what I have to say about Muhammed, don’t anyone take my word for it. Please, do your own DD, and then tell me what part of this is untrue….
First, Muhammed was a war-monger.
Second, for a prophet, he didn’t know pagan gods (or demi-gods – whatever). What kind of prophet doesn’t even recognize when God is talking to him? Moreover, he didn’t even understand who Abraham, Moses and Jesus were until the Jews explained it to him. Yet he claims Islam is intended to set the record straight, because the Jews and Christians got it all wrong. How can that be if he didn’t have any clue about the people he was talking about and had to rely on the Jews to help him interpret what God was telling him?
Third, in “reciting” the Koran, he pushed, if you will, thousands of very repetitive verses that fall into two basic categories: warnings as to what will happen to the unbelievers; and instructions on what to say to the Christians and Jews. But, he didn’t separate them, as two distinct themes. Rather, he intertwined these verses, so that they alternate. That maximizes the chance of blurring the distinctions, and maximizes the chance of confusing the Christians and the Jews with the unbelievers. And, clearly, that is exactly what has happened. But, if these two sets of ideas were intended to be distinct and different, then why not either say so or separate them? That’s no accident, because this technique is repeated over and over and over throughout the Koran. By so-doing, it creates a tone – an impression – that is anti-Judeo-Christian without explicitly saying so. As a form of political brainwashing, it’s truly ingenious.
Fourth, the Koran deconstructs both Judaism and Christianity. It does not deconstruct the “self” (i.e., the “believer”). This is why there has never been any real, serious exegesis of the Koran in 1,300 years. (In contrast, Christianity entered modernity when the Reformation brought about a new, critical deconstruction.) But, the Koran simply does not lend itself to it, because it eschews introspection. The greater emphasis is placed on condemning others. And this is yet another reason why there is virtually no criticism or questioning of the Koran: the downside risk of being labeled an “unbeliever” is too severe. And infidels, of course, are dealt with harshly. Consequently, the substance and tone of the Koran tend to operate to encourage people to point fingers at everyone else, lest someone point fingers at them first. IMO, what you see in the Islamic world today is the natural by-product of this kind of thinking, and it all came out of the mouth of Muhammed.
Fifth, the Koran is only part of a wider body of literature, known as hadith, that is based on what Muhammed said and did. When you look at the hadith, you see all the violence – you see all the references to jihad fi sabil Illah (jihad in the path of God) that are clearly military efforts, and not merely the more innocuous version of jihad, i.e.,”striving” (though, even striving, it turns out, is not completely innocuous, but I’ll omit that discussion here). So, here you have Muhammed characterizing his battles against others as jihad in the path of God. What more need I say? In the aftermath of 9/11, you see the Islamic world trying to play down the non-Koranic hadith (in statements for western consumption, that is) because it’s not pretty. But, go check out the hadith for yourself, and then ask whether I am vilifying Muhammed. He did it all to himself. I’m just the messenger.
Sixth, the Koran and hadith, as I’m sure everyone realizes by now, is also a political blueprint. It comes with its own set of laws, known as Sharia, which includes some barbaric punishments. It also devotes a good amount of attention to the who, what, when, where and why of waging war. The world is divided into two camps: Dar al-Islam (House of Islam) and Dar al-Harb (House of War). All lands that are ruled according to Muslim law are Dar al-Islam and all lands ruled by anyone else (e.g., the U.S.) are Dar al-Harb. This is Muhammed’s grand and enlightened world view. You might want to contrast that with the teachings of Christ or Buddha. But, because the Koran is also a political/legal document, you can go pick up a Muslim newspaper here in the U.S. and read for yourselves the ongoing discussions about whether Muslims should accept the U.S. Constitution only conditionally, and only to the extent that it conforms to the Koran. Read these discussions for yourselves; I have.
Seventh, the Koran, ontologically, incorporates a notion of “justice for this physical plane of reality. But, I would suggest to you that it is justice without mercy. Read the Koran and hadith for yourselves, and decide for yourselves how much mercy is contained in it. I think it is merciless. But, if you think about it, we wouldn’t need justice at all if we all had mercy. Now, granted, both are ideals that we strive for in an imperfect world, and we don’t achieve either with anything close to perfection. However, that does not change the fact that one of those ideals is “higher” than the other. If we had mercy, we would not need justice. But, note how the converse is not true: if we have justice, we still need mercy. ( And earthly power doth then show likest God s, when Mercy seasons Justice. – The Merchant of Venice)
The fact that mercy is not achieved with perfection is not a justification for abandoning mercy in favor of justice, because justice can not be achieved with perfection either. So, in abandoning mercy in favor of justice, all we have really done is abandoned a higher ideal for a lesser one. The world will still be imperfect, only now it is pursuing a lesser ideal. That is clearly an inferior ontology. Anyway, Christ preached mercy, but Muhammed derogates mercy in favor of justice – when he’s not busy fighting wars, that is.
I’ll finish with a few thoughts and some of my own conclusions:
I have a friend and he is a Muslim. As I was giving him a ride home, we were talking about the Iraq situation, and had an interesting and friendly discussion. He’s a nice guy, and all that. And I guess one would say he has a lot of “western” values. He believes in God, but isn’t very religious, and most of his friends here in the U.S. are not Muslim. But, the fact is that he’s a hell of a lot more enlightened that Muhammed ever was. And, I know he’s not the only one, but I would have to say the same thing about other Muslims like him – they are all far more enlightened than Muhammed, and more enlightened than the Koran itself. So both my friend and I are sort of in the same boat – we both are more enlightened than Muhammed, and we both are less enlightened than Christ. More power to anyone who seeks enlightenment, but you won’t find it in the life of Muhammed, because we’ve already surpassed him, and that includes my friend.
To put it another way, based on my reading of the Koran, hadith, and the life of Muhammed, I don’t think the militant extremists are the ones who have corrupted the Koran. I think they have it exactly right. I think it’s the Muslims, like my friend those who actually believe in getting along with others – who have “corrupted” the Koran. I applaud them for doing it, obviously. It warms my heart to see the Kurds in northern Iraq creating such a civilized community for themselves amidst all the surrounding violence and turmoil, and despite all that has been done to them. I applaud all of that. But, Muhammed wouldn’t applaud it, so let’s just be clear about that. And that is what makes Islam dangerous: the closer you get to its core – the closer you get to the hadith and to Muhammed – the more dangerous it gets. Yet, this enduring seed is impenetrable. It’s like trying to get rid of a wart; you can try to get rid of the dead skin and the “growth,” but until you drill down and get that virus that’s at the root, it keeps coming back.
There’s an expression: the problem with communism is communism, but the problem with capitalism is capitalists. Whether you agree with that or not, the point it is trying to make is that, with communism, it is the idea itself that is flawed; with capitalism, on the other hand, it’s not the idea that is flawed, but the way it is practiced. (Again, I’m not interested in anyone arguing about whether that’s true; the point is to see the kind of distinction being drawn.) Well, I would say the same thing about Islam and Christianity: the problem with Islam is Islam, and the problem with Christianity is Christians. In other words, Christianity would be a really great thing if people actually emulated Christ, but they don t always. But, for all the peace-loving Muslims out there (and I don’t deny they are out there) who believe in religious tolerance, and love and compassion even for non-Muslims – for all of them, Muhammed is not someone to be emulated, but, rather, someone who must be overcome. I do agree that there is an important distinction that must be made.. but to bring the two together, Christians need to uncover Christ, while Muslims need to bury Muhammed.
And now there seems to be a military coup underway in Turkey.
Military authorities claiming to be the Turkish General Staff have announced a successful change of government.
Islamist President Erdogan, his prime minister and other in the Erdogan government beg to differ.
Turkish Police supporting Erdogan seem to have been on the losing end of several fights with military coup forces in and around Ankara, who have Turkish Air Force and Turkish Army helicopter gunship support.
The General in charge of Turkish military forces, and a Erdogan creature, seems to be a hostage in the grasp of Turkish military Coup forces.
Erdogan is seeking asylum in Germany.
See this twitter feed:
Kyle Griffin ”Ž@kylegriffin1
Senior US military source tells NBC News that Erdogan, refused landing rights in Istanbul, is reported to be seeking asylum in Germany.
4:26 PM – 15 Jul 2016
824 824 Retweets
138 138 likes
See the following twitter feed for the latest on the
Turkish Coup —
https://twitter.com/hashtag/TurkeyCoup?src=hash
I know it is counter intuitive but defensive wars may be more expensive than offensive wars. Think about defending everyone, everywhere, 24/7, and the costs involved in hardening every potential target. Then consider the resources it would consume and multiply that exponentially by the lost opportunity costs, just as you would for offensive war. No one has the wealth to sustain that indefinitely. In the USA, there are 9,000,000+ square miles, 300+ million soft targets, 10s upon 10s of thousands of public and infrastructure targets, thousands of entry points, and multiple means of attack (dirty bombs, biological threats, poison gas, planes, IEDs) to bring death and destruction OR economic disruption. Besides the human cost, think what 9/11 cost the American economy; then consider child hostages on school buses, bringing in Ebola, contaminating a reservoir, attacking a nuclear power plant, major bridges or terminals, containers or LNG tankers . WE live in a completely interdependent world.
The attacker holds all the cards; they know how, when, why, where……That is why, it is sometimes more prudent to take the battle to the enemy, especially the enemies capacity to make war, ala Patton and Sherman. I’m just a regular Joe, but it appears to me that the Bush administration used a honey pot defense to buy time to build up a security infrastructure.
OTOH I am convinced there is nothing they would enjoy more than to be targets of America. It elevates them. It’s a booby trap. You can find as many justifications for attacking Iran, Nigeria, or Saudi Arabia for that matter.
Whether he ate pork or not is pointless since Jihad gives absolution for past sins. Wasn’t one of the female Paris attackers a bar-hopping party girl or something?
“Islamist President Erdogan, his prime minister and other in the Erdogan government beg to differ.”
I think they are gone. I hope the Army officers who were so friendly to us in 2006 are OK and are some of the people in the junta.
Turkey was a friend when it was ruled by the Army. Ditto for Egypt. Muslims do not seem to handle democracy well.
Has anyone seen any stats on tourism or airline travel over the last year? I have seen more than the usual airfare sales, given that this is the summer.
Call me cynical, but I expect the Davos caste and their minions to just go through the motions until this starts biting them in the ass financially.
One last heartfelt random thought. God Bless the frackers. Where would be today without them? It’s not just that we are less dependent on the ME but I can’t imagine where the economically “left behind” population would be if energy prices had stayed up like the elites wanted.
Margaret….”Make people afraid to dissent openly and over time it will become more and more difficult for them to dissent even in the privacy of their own thoughts.
Embedding the preferred narrative in the language is just one of the tools for crushing independent thought, but it’s a very powerful one. Look at the magically invented new pronouns. Anybody who actually uses “ze, zir, zem” with a straight face has already conceded his mind to our new overlords.”
I suspect that many of the *academic* promulgator of these things actually really believe in them, as do some of the more hysterical activists who pick them up. Politicians, though, mostly go along with them as a matter of convenience. And the vast army of people who care most about being accepted by the Kool Kidz don’t really care about the truth value of anything much at all, just who it aligns them with.
Oh, academics! The ones in the humanities have already had their brains softened by the constant drip-drip-drip of political correctness; I don’t count them. And you’re right, of course, about the people who care only about being accepted by the Kool Kidz.
What worries me is the extent to which this loopy view of the world is being pushed on the rest of us. It’s okay for you and me; we’ve had our careers. But if I were working for somebody else today… I’m ashamed to admit this, but I don’t think I’d be as outspoken as I was the last time I had a day job. The mere fact that political opinions have no bearing on my competence as a software developer would no longer save me. The pressure is intimidating.
Even being self-employed is no insulation from the pressure, at least not in my field; major publishers’ brains have already been devoured. I think SF writers who don’t parrot Ruling Class requirements have nowhere left to go except Baen Books or indie publishing.
I don’t think were are even close to the point of taking action against muslims. I think there will be two important indicators for when we are close to that point.
1. Muslims are abused and attacked in the street at random and are afraid to go anywhere alone.
2. People who witness such attacks do not help, call the police or do anything else to stop it.
At that point, the mood will have changed from “protect the innocent ones” to “they are all the enemy”. Then the public won’t care about collective punishment, they will be right behind it.
The Turkish coup is over and beheading has begun.
A soldier lies beheaded after surrendering to the Erdogan mob.
Turkey is lost to the west.
As I wrote:-
What should the West be doing? My views, being slightly more robust than some, include the following:-
Close ALL the Saudi-funded Wahabbi-led mosques, and deport immediately all the Saudi-funded imams and mullahs; along with their extensive families, broods and supporters.
Close down, immediately, all Madrassas and so-called Islamic schools, and either deport or restrict the so-called teachers.
Ban, immediately, all Sharia courts, and deport or imprison, if necessary, those who push this alternate justice system; as by allowing ‘sharia’, they push the system which encourages the diminution of women to a second class status.
Ban not only the burka, but any form of head covering which is worn to signify religious observance. Ban also any dress, garment or covering which signifies adherence to the Muslim religion or belief.
Remove, immediately, the offer or existence of translation services from any Court, local council or national Government office or website. The language of the United Kingdom is English, and the Stormont Assembly, along with the Welsh and the Scots crew should be also reminded of this fact. (and the Cornish can get stuffed as well!)
Polygamy is illegal, and all the jungle-bunnies should be reminded of this fact; and if any attempt to claim for two, three or more so-called wives, they should be reminded by a hefty fine and at least three years in the slammer.
The State Religion is Anglicanism, based upon Christianity, and nothing else. If anyone wishes to live under Islamic law, they should move to a bloody Islamic country!
“The State Religion is Anglicanism, based upon Christianity, and nothing else”. Come off it. Scotland and England have different established churches; Wales and N Ireland don’t have established churches at all; all four countries share the same Chief Rabbi. Good God, the taxpayer pays for Roman Catholic schools, even when they have been trying to persuade their charges to hate Protestants (as happened to a cousin of mine).
There is no state religion in the UK; we enjoy complete religious freedom – more so, perhaps, than the US since we are subjected to no social pressure to join a church; more so perhaps than France, since we are under no social pressure to adopt political secularism; more so perhaps than Germany, since no taxes are raised to fund churches (as distinct from church schools).
The only exception that I can think of is the requirement that the monarch and a few related parties must not be Roman Catholic. And after the experience of various cousins, and in the light of centuries of history, I can see the wisdom of that.
I’ve noticed a disconnect on how ideas advance in America lately. We’re into an election season, wherein the candidates seek majorities of votes. But apparently this is the only time majorities matter. Outside election season, the Left pushes change onto the population through activism and the courts; in fact, some state propositions, after receiving a majority of votes, have been overturned in the courts (see: California). The transgender issue is only the latest instance of the public having a “solution” shoved down its throat.
A brave politician would gain traction in today’s environment by asking “at what point does the majority get to have a say in how far, and how fast, the national culture changes?” I think if the transgender issue came up for a vote, it would be soundly defeated. (And I say “brave politician” because the subsequent reaction from the Left would be horrendous.)
There are some issues and ideas that exist on the fringe of society, and they ought to stay there. Instead, the Left finds two people who believe an outrageous idea, and that idea then needs to be mainstreamed as an “equally viable alternative lifestyle.” As Micheal Walsh said, “enough!”
One final thought: I just retired from DOD service and one of our annual training requirements was awareness of human trafficking. Then I read that our own government has been moving illegal immigrants around the country with zero fanfare and zero heads-up to local and state governments. I’m surprise no one has challenged the federal government using “trafficking in humans” laws as a pretext. Discovery would be interesting.
“the taxpayer pays for Roman Catholic schools,”
A friend in Ireland told us that she sent their Catholic children to the non-Catholic schools because the class size was much less and the quality of education was better.
She is South African and met her Irish husband on one of her father’s ships where he was working as a shipping agent.
She said her neighbors were outraged. She didn’t care. They lived near Cork.
“Shut up Pennie.”
Nope. I have decided to go to war on the god issue. It is among the biggest problem humans have, and is ridiculous and evil.
Ya know that Turkish coup is looking more and more like a set up job. Erdogan is unchained now. The army is the traditional check on religion in Turkey and now has been sidelined by this failed coup. He can pursue his dream of being the Caliph now.
Suppression of the facts, denial, collusion. We talked about how how this goes/ends. After hearing Valls say they have to live with “it”, I can only think of Mussolini, Ceausescu. You can’t swear to defend and protect, and then tell people they have to accept this. Unless it’s already a dictatorship.
http://gatesofvienna.net/2016/07/french-police-confront-an-islamic-terrorist-over-piles-of-corpses/
Dearieme – I’m an American and I have never belonged to a church. There is really very little social pressure in the US to belong to a church.
PenGun – The Nice terrorist like many other Moslem terrorists does not seem to have been very religious. You are incorrect in thinking that religion is the root of the problem. The root of the problem is the genetic incompatibility of Middle Easterners and Europeans.
Mike K. – Turkey was never the West’s to lose.
Mike Cunningham – Ending the problem will require more than just deporting imams, mullahs and other religious leaders and more than just banning Islam as a religion. Religion is not the root of the problem. Europeans, particularly Western Europeans, are genetically incompatible with Middle Eastern populations.
“The army is the traditional check on religion in Turkey and now has been sidelined by this failed coup.”
On this I agree with you but Islam is not a religion. It is a social system like communism.
More evidence for a false flag coup in Turkey.
Now that the coup has clearly failed, we can conclude that this must have been the most incompetent attempted takeover in Turkey’s troubled history. When part of the military launched their offensive last night (Turkish time), I immediately checked news channels supporting President Erdogan. Surprisingly, none of them were taken over. The only broadcaster that was taken over was TRT Haber, the state news channel. But NTV and other channels supporting Erdogan were left alone.
This will not end well.
“You are incorrect in thinking that religion is the root of the problem. The root of the problem is the genetic incompatibility of Middle Easterners and Europeans.”
Not at all. They are cross fertile, so the same species. ;)
I have no real problem with religion, it’s god I don’t like. You know, the one who’s name they never shut up about. If they could not exclaim ‘god is great’ every time they fired a weapon, they would probably give up and go home. If your friendly neighborhood racist bigot, could not claim they had talked to god, and that he told them, whatever was evil, their madness would be more apparent and less influential.
Jim,
Your social darwinism is showing. It is a cultural incompatibility and culture is not much influenced by genetics as compared to other factors. If it is genetic, could you please tell us just which parts of our DNA need to be screened for western cultural compatibility?
I’m not saying that changing the deeply help values instilled by a culture based on nomadic tribal warfare and thievery is not difficult to change, maybe even practically impossible to change, but it is not genetic.
Death6
Orwell understocd the power that is both expressed and reinforced by saying black is white and white black – my personal favorite at present is that “All lives matter” is racist and “All black lives matter” is not. Arguing that it is insensitive to accept what another “thinks” he is and not those that see children as both innocent and vulnerable.
Anonymous – Culture is an epiphenomenon. All biological phenomena are driven by polynucleotides. Human behavior is no exception.
Anonymous – If people live under conditions of nomadic tribal warfare and thievery that creates selection for the genes for that behavior. When such people move into a different environment the genes do not change. Over a long period of time the selective forces of a new environment can shift the frequency of genes for various behaviors. But this takes many, many generations.
In the very long run Middle Easterners may change genetically as part of the evolutionary process as of course Western Europeans may change. But in say the next century or so the only “solution” to the problem of their incompatibility with Western Europeans is some combination of genocide or expulsion/ethnic cleansing by one or both sides against the other.
Culture is an epiphenomenon. All biological phenomena are driven by polynucleotides.
I agree with this a lot. Maybe not completely because I think culture has a moderating influence.
The present black inner city scene is a live version of the Hawk Dove game.
Hawks do well when the majority are doves. When there are too many hawks, they fight and kill each other.
Something similar may be operating in the Middle East with the Arabs and Muslims although Pakistanis seem to to go after females more than each other.
Young Arab men are not the kind of immigrants any civilized society would want but expressing that idea will get you warned or banned from Facebook and England.
I think it is probably genetic plus culture, the “Shame Honor Culture” so well described by David Pryce-Jones in “The Closed Circle.”
Stephen Pinker has done a good job of explaining even without genetics in “The Blank Slate.”
He wrote that years ago and it is excellent.
PenGun, if you think the world is chaotic now, just wait until God splits.
“just wait until God splits”: I thought Christians thought he’s split in three already.
PenGun can’t bring himself to say Islam, I guess. I also imagine he’s pretty outraged about the Christian based groups beheading, killing, and maiming the Jews and the Muslims in…wherever. Yep it’s the belief in God that’s the problem.
What Doug Halker said.
RE PenGun’s view: note that Mohamed thought himself god, able to define reality according to his writing (thinking). (Any parallel between that and current groups is entirely not coincidental, PenGun and his kin notwithstanding.)
And, just because no one has said it while it is so obvious: We should conclude from Mohamed and his truck that we must allow only those with government licenses to drive trucks. Further more we should ban assault trucks. Or at least limit all trucks to no more than 30 mph.
“Yep it’s the belief in God that’s the problem.”
Indeed, well not really the belief it’s self, but acting as if there was a god, obeying his chosen messengers to the point of any damn thing.
Right now the extreme stress the Islamic religion has been placed under has revealed it’s extreme position. Both the Christian and Jewish branches of that religion have had their times at bat and probably will again.
It’s as well such a silly simplification of an amazing mystery that is both our parent and our sustenance.
“Right now the extreme stress the Islamic religion has been placed under has revealed it’s extreme position. Both the Christian and Jewish branches of that religion have had their times at bat and probably will again.”
PenGun, you’re not that ignorant. Christianity (Christ’s way) is one of peace and coexistence…the central theme. If you think that that’s the way of Mohamed, and our Muslim friend’s central creed you need to think again. Don’t be perverse, I think you know better.
When it was about the pieds-noirs (Europeans in Algeria) in 1962, the Arabs told them to choose “la valise ou le cercueil,” the suitcase or the coffin — leave or be killed. How long will it be before the French offer the same terms to the Arabs?
“note that Mohamed thought himself god”: oh no he didn’t. He claimed to be a prophet. Or, at least, that’s what everyone has been told for 1400 years – how sound the evidence is, God knows.
Air-doo-Juan throws up gang signals, guy that lives in Rainbow House demands he be supported:
https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2016/07/16/today-president-erdogan-presents-the-rabba-salute-affirming-ideological-alignment-with-muslim-brotherhood/
Who needs a truck when you got the Lyin’ Hawaiian on your crew?
“the extreme stress the Islamic religion has been placed under”
The extreme stress is the failure of Muslim societies which see western civilization thriving and which have only oil revenues to avoid a subsistence economy.
The “Golden Age” of Harun al Rashid and his son were a period from 786 to 833 and most of the “Golden Age” accomplishments such as “The Age of Translation,” were performed by Greek “converts” who did the translations from Greek to Arabic. Jewish physicians such as Maimonides who lived in the late 12th century provided many of the “accomplishments of the Arabs and Islam. There were a few short-lived science successes but tyranny does not mesh well with science.
The Turks were successful soldiers but Napoleon easily swept them away and they were humiliated, as Islam has been ever since.
Now, the soldiers of Islam, using guns, airplanes, rockets and trucks invented and built in the West, are trying to take us all back to the 7th century.
“Napoleon easily swept them away”: not at the Siege of Acre, he didn’t.
“Christianity (Christ’s way) is one of peace and coexistence”: compared to Mo’s way it certainly is, in principle if not remotely in practice. But it’s not completely about peace: “Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.”
And didn’t he instruct his chaps to fetch swords after the Last Supper? Wasn’t an ear lopped off? (and then repaired, I’ll grant you.)
Penny, since you have declared war on religion, it would behoove you to go after the most violent religious sect first, after you get finished wiping out Islam, then Christianity and Judaism would be easy meat for your super powers, and Buddhism and Hindu even easier.
Since you are a guy who can keep pumas at bay with just a glance on the walking trails in B.C., you can go to the muzzie websites and demand they cease and desist their beliefs and argue with them about it, letting them know where you are located at….
I bet you won’t do that, chickenshit. Much more dangerous than trolling a conservative/liberterian websites in the pay of Putin’s cronies.
“Penny, since you have declared war on religion, it would behoove you to go after the most violent religious sect first, after you get finished wiping out Islam, then Christianity and Judaism would be easy meat for your super powers, and Buddhism and Hindu even easier.”
Just on god. I have no real problem with religion. I have been a follower of the Buddha for over 50 years now, a religion that needs no god.
Now these people Christ, Mohamed, the various Jewish prophets all have a deep understanding. The problem is it’s not deep enough. There is a Buddhist saying about Christ: “Almost a Buddha.” His understanding, deep as it was, missed the point, in that what he understood as his father, was actually an insight into the unity of the entire Universe. That he anthropomorphied this into almighty god is understandable as his entire structure came from the Jewish religion, with it’s rather mysterious supreme being.
“not at the Siege of Acre, he didn’t.”
The French attempted to lay siege on 20 March using only their infantry. Napoleon believed the city would capitulate quickly to him.[3] In correspondence with one of his subordinate officers he voiced his conviction that a mere two weeks would be necessary to capture the linchpin of his conquest of the Holy Land before marching on to Jerusalem.
Also, the British captured his siege artillery.
Not the best example.
The Ottomans were shocked at how easily the French swept them away in the other encounters.
Culture is an epiphenomenon. All biological phenomena are driven by polynucleotides
Or, as Breitbart might’ve put it, culture lives downstream from biology.
PenGun, radical violent Buddhism also happens.
“PenGun, radical violent Buddhism also happens.”
Oh, I know. It’s very sad.
The Buddha actually predicted his religion would not last all that long, and that that the church created around it, would be the cause of it’s end. It’s most fortunate that the offshoots are so useful. Zen with it’s transmission completely outside the scriptures, has been one source of longevity, that perhaps the Buddha did not foresee.
Culture as an epiphenomenon of biology…
In the same sense, you could say that an operating system or a missile guidance program is an epiphenomenon of the gates and latches in the computer processor and memory. But if you actually what to understand what an operating system does, you are going to need concepts like ‘tasks’ and ‘threads’ and ‘interrupts.’ If you want to understand what the missile guidance system does, you need to understand concepts like ‘acceleration’ and ‘velocity’ and ‘filter.’
A complex system can only be understood with the aid of concepts which are at or near the conceptual level of the system, not limited to those that are 5 or 7 levels below it.
“Not the best example.” On the contrary it was an excellent example. Napoleon having murdered surrendered Turkish soldiers from an earlier siege, the Turks fought very well at Acre and gave The Corsican a bloody nose. Which was more than most other armies had managed.
All that was required was a bit of stiffening, happily supplied by Napoleon’s wicked behaviour, and the Royal Navy.
Dearieme, Agreed that the presented (in contrast to actual)story is that Mohamed claimed no more than being a prophet, as everyone has been told for 1400 yrs. But nB the actual reality: redefinition of reality as described by Mohamed, said definitions to fit his own wants and concerns. Thus, eg, the contradictions between the (roughly) first half of his writings (when he and followers were militarily weaker) and the last half (when they had gathered forces sufficient for conquest of opposition). Thus, eg, his adding “revelation” that would allow him to take multiple wives, even take young girls. You probably know the historical record, may have read the Koran. I did no more than suggest the aware reader connect the dots: Mohamed claimed for himself the power to declare reality, to define right and wrong. Equals claim to deity. Different circumstances but same issue with currently in vogue groups that insist that what they believe about themselves today defines what they are today in contrast with yesterday and who knows about tomorrow. Even same thing with PenGun: he makes his beliefs the final standard, the final test of morality.