For the record, Nazi Germany was mostly peaceful, as was the Soviet Union. Even when our Civil War was raging, and 600,000 of us died, most of the country was peaceful. Even those who were in service and/or near the fronts had long periods where there were no cannons firing at the moment. Lots of nervous waiting. Combat deployment itself can be mostly peaceful – though admittedly in the sense of “no active shooting” rather than any sense of restfulness. Much of medieval warfare was sieges, or moving from one place to another, or setting up camp. Mostly peaceful. Yet the small amounts of “not peaceful” mattered greatly then, and matter greatly now.
The excuse of “mostly peaceful protests” is rather empty. If decent people should have refused to show up at Charlottesville because they knew there was a fair chance someone would turn violent, and to attend would give them cover and legitimacy, then how do we justify showing up in Seattle? Maybe we can. But then we have to extend that in both directions. We feel very, very different about protests we agree with, don’t we? It just feels different, and we just know it’s right.
Somewhat related, but worth noting, is the memory of press reporting on “violence taking place at Trump rallies” in 2016.
And it a sense, they were somewhat correct, if largely inflated, but things were occurring there that one might well be considered reportable. ‘Cause, you know, they were basically Nazi rallies, etc etc.
But (Godwin’s Law alert) the historical fact is, there was no violence at Hitler’s rallies. Basically none. Why? Because Hitler’s rallies were not where the violence was! Because Hitler’s opponents, shockingly enough, did not send people to Hitler’s rallies to foment violence. Hitler’s people, however, happily sent provocateurs to his opponent’s rallies to foment violence, which they did. And that is where the violence occurred.
And lo, there was no violence at any Hillary rallies…. because Trump’s people did not send agents on the ground to Hillary rallies to foment such violence. And was there violence at Trump rallies? And sent there by whom, now? Uh huh.
And in both cases, a most fundamental element on all four sides as discussed above, is that everyone knew just what rallies participants would respond to provocateurs with serious thumping of skulls and breaking of jaws, and which rallies in turn the provocateurs would remain unharmed and treated as essentially irritants that had to be put up with. We all know which rallies would be expected to act in such manner, and which would not.
I have no illusions that that fact would speak the volumes that it jolly well should, but it be truth nonetheless.
“We all know which rallies would be expected to act in such manner, and which would not.”
Gosh, what should we learn from all this history, re violence….
Hmmm….
I recall a quote from General Sherman, badly no doubt- “war is what our enemies have chosen, and I say give it to them.”
It seems to me the left has made the same choice the Antebellum South made, and sooner or later they will get all the violence they can wish for, only aimed at themselves.
Interesting times we live in, alas.
For the record, Nazi Germany was mostly peaceful,
Herman Wouk has a story in his two volume novel of WWII about Jews rebelling and attacking their guards in the death camps. He felt it necessary to include the account (based on a real event), I’m sure, because such episodes were so rare.
Two effects I’ve seen in Israel. One there was a big drive to become farmers early on, especially by the European Jews who had been barred from land ownership and farming.
Second, the will to fight and resist because so many of their families did not and perished.
As we are quoting Sherman, let me give you one that I thought for the longest time was Sherman (once a resident of the South as superintendent of the Louisiana State Seminary of Learning & Military Academy) but in reality turned out to be from the Confederate hostile Texan, Sam Houston:
Let me tell you what is coming. After the sacrifice of countless millions of treasure and hundreds of thousands of lives, you may win Southern independence if God be not against you, but I doubt it. I tell you that, while I believe with you in the doctrine of states rights, the North is determined to preserve this Union. They are not a fiery, impulsive people as you are, for they live in colder climates. But when they begin to move in a given direction, they move with the steady momentum and perseverance of a mighty avalanche; and what I fear is, they will overwhelm you.
We stand upon a volcano, and I hear the cracking of rock. You just keep it up Antifa, and there is a very strong liklihood you will experience an avalanche up close.
@ Andrew X – Thank you. I will remember that example in my online conversations.
Sigh, that’s what happens when one isn’t quick enough. My thanks to Andrew X was in reference to his upper comment. The latter one is fine, too, but not what I was looking for.